A Re-evaluation of the Balwyn UFO Photograph

Discussion in 'UFOs & Sightings' started by nivek, May 9, 2019.

  1. Double Nought Spy

    Double Nought Spy Celestial

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    I've never found any way to get to that conclusion without basing it on a series of assumptions. I don't like assumptions, and try to avoid making them. If I'm going to assume something, it's likely to be that I know a hell of a lot less about the Universe than I think I do.
     
  2. Rick Hunter

    Rick Hunter Celestial

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    Is that one of Ed Walters' creations?
     
  3. UfoScan

    UfoScan UFO scanner

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    Just recently found this thread. I am the author of the article in the OP. I wrote this a few years ago after quite a lengthy examination of the case as well as working with investigators in Australia who went on site to take recent pictures of the location.

    I have been interested in UFO research since the age of 8 (back in the sixties) and was always suspicious of the UFO pictures I came across in books and magazines. I would say that, over the years , I have come to the conclusion that most of the UFO pictures we see in the media are hoaxes.

    But the Kibel picture is one that got me to take a second look. At first I was pretty sure it was fake. Another UFO researcher had shown me a picture he had taken of a metal bowl that looked pretty close to what we see in the Kibel picture. And he claimed that the reflection might be of a house behind the photographer. But we got aerial pictures of the house from that time period and there was no other house behind it. The challenge is not only to try and throw an object in the air or suspend it on a wire but to have it reflect the roof of the house. Keep in mind that were you to suspend an object like this on its side you would have a hard time keeping it still. So the likelihood of taking a picture just when it is reflecting the roof of the house is minimal. Furthermore, for that object to reflect the roof of the house, it would have to be on the other side of it (as I show in my article) and therefore would need to be quite large.

    I am not saying this picture is 100% proven authentic but that it would be extremely difficult to reproduce it using a Polaroid camera of the type he was using.
     
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  4. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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    That's one of my most favourite cases, both because of quality of witness and photograph he made.

    A big problem in ufology is this non-scientific mindset where people are constantly asking "show me your best". One can not study a transient phenomena, like UFOs, with statistical sample of "the ONE best case". The reason why this UFO case is so powerful is because it fits into the statistical trends for physical characteristics of UFOs from hundreds of other cases. So consistency of of physical behaviour had been preserved.

    Another aspect that is missed by 99% of general UFO researchers is the context of modern scientific knowledge. The first next question that one should ask is "does this UFO case fit into modern physics"? I am sorry to say that common knowledge of geometry is only good to explain behaviour of mechanical objects like cars and aeroplanes. And Balwyn case certainly fits into concepts of advanced physics, like electrodynamics and general relativity.

    These are two good reasons why Balwyn case is so important.
     
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  5. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    It's pics like that - and the excellent analysis - that keep me interested.

    There is a limit to the value of a photograph with these esoteric topics; they're not going to 'prove' anything. But this one's weird and IMO doesn't give a skeptic a lot of traction.
     
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  6. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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    Its not about proving anything, it is about collecting and analysing information. For example, Baldwin UFO picture and many other similar cases tells us a lot about UFO propulsion.

    From the information that we currently have about aliens we can understand their intentions and find out weak points in their capabilities. These two points can help us strengthen our own position.
     
  7. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    I'm not so fast to try and make a silk purse from a sow's ear.
     
  8. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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    I know, we are herd animals, aren't we. General Relativity is hardly sow's ear.
     
  9. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    Excellent write up, I thoroughly enjoyed reading your article, and glad you found us here, Welcome to Alien Expanse...

    ...
     
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  10. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    For every intriguing pic like this one there are how many that are outright hoaxes, misidentification, what have you. Not a very good ratio there
     
  11. The shadow

    The shadow The shadow knows!

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    Awesome responses here. I'm satisfied the pic is the real deal. It does not match up with a known terrestrial object. No strings or wires evident. And making a convincing double exposure is hard
     
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  12. UfoScan

    UfoScan UFO scanner

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    Thank you for all your responses and comments !

    I would like to underline however that I prefer to remain completely objective on the matter. In other words, all I can ascertain is that this picture would be extremely difficult to reproduce using a model and a Polaroid camera from this time period. But I can't conclude that this is a craft from another world even though that is a distinct possibility.

    I always remain alert to anything I may have overlooked that might reveal a way this could have been faked. But at this point in my research, I simply don't think it is likely. The one thing that left me somewhat frustrated is that Mr. Kibel refused to have us make a higher resolution scan of his picture - even after reading my article.

    Recently however, we learned that James Kibel just passed away and we are hoping that eventually, his estate will allow us access to the picture for even more in-depth analysis.
     
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  13. The shadow

    The shadow The shadow knows!

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    I really appreciate your post! Very insightful.
    If you have a moment could you comment on my thoughts on the Trent photos?
    Are the Trent photos legit?
     
  14. UfoScan

    UfoScan UFO scanner

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    I actually commented on the Trent pictures in your thread before reading your post !

    My view on the Trent pictures is that they are hoaxes as are the Rex Heflin pictures and... so many others !

    As a photographer who actually started out by making fake UFO pictures at age 13 and then went on to study the effects of "false perspective", there are lots of telltale details that one notices whch may go unnoticed by most.

    Of course, anyone is "free to believe". My perspective is that UFO photographs are not a matter of belief but of observation and analysis.
     
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  15. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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    Trent pictures were real. Critical factor was not perspective, because object was too far for that, but fading away due to depth of atmosphere. When haze is taken account than things work out as they should. @Thomas R. Morrison here did a very good analysis year ago somewhere in some thread here in the forum.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021 at 6:28 AM
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  16. Rick Hunter

    Rick Hunter Celestial

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    Early 1950's was a real saucer wave in the USA also.
     
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  17. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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    @Thom
    There is a channel on YT Only Real UFOs. Practically the show at least 2 good UFOs every week. Most in US.

    No abductions though, aliens take one's mobile when the get people.
     
  18. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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  19. Skepticide123

    Skepticide123 Asymmetric Contact From Hyperdimensional Aliens.

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    It's funny seeing all the analyses. It reminds me of the folks at some forums who come up with a new mundane "scientific" theory for UFOs about every hour --all of them wrong, and then accuse others of speculation. Personally I KNOW the McMinnville UFO photos are real, as my experience was tied to the 60th anniversary of the photo being taken --and the objects were coming from McMinnville airspace when I saw them (it). I actually think that the five gravitically entrained objects I saw perhaps later buzzed military ships. There was the encounter with the bright object recently hovering over a warship's deck while it was moving. These kinds of objects and the formation I saw have been seen repeatedly in the past --who know how far back. As mentioned before my office mate for over a decade was literally the Trent's next door neigbor --he said his parents knew them and there was NO way they were "sophisticated enough to pull off a hoax like that"...
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021 at 12:31 PM
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  20. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Celestial

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    Can you explain it a bit more ... are you saying McMinnvile UFOs fly over the same path every year?

    Exactly, that's the same thing the editor of local news paper said about Trent family. Editor believed them because they were just a common straightforward folk. Photos were found behind the pillow on the sofa, that was covered by children toys. Trents just had had bought the new camera recently and made a photo without thinking about whole hullabaloo that will follow.
     

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