Chemtrail: Conspiracy theory or truth?

[Area201]

Now I'm often blinded by my own ideas and forget alternatives. It's equally possible that I'm wrong about how this was done Zeke, and that everything else you said is true, just as you've put forward yourself. In fact, in thinking about this for a few minutes it is even more likely that an alternative explanation is more plausible, one which does in fact validate you but also still supports the notion that this was all engineered.

Let me state that one of the reasons I came over to this site was because I was impressed with a lot of your input earlier on various subjects and to get good discussion/debate.

I agree with your sentiments on the terms conspiracy and debunking. I am also somewhat averse to aliens and ufos, but these are the accepted terms used by public and we use for practical measure.

I'm also intrigued with your man-made ufo/alien phenomenon arguments and, even though I think some are actual ET origin, there is room for your practical man-made perspective to fit into the big picture, no doubt. Your ARV insights are very compelling.

So back to 9/11. I'm a "soft truther" or only believe in a "lite" version of the engineering of the events. As such, the deep state behind invading middle east and so on, needed a false flag, saw Bin Laden and his operatives brewing the plan.. and they simply allowed for it to happen, stand down NORAD defense, and earlier helped them with acquiring passports, made sure they got basic flight training, and so on. I don't see a need for any remote control of the planes, it's not rocket science to get into cockpit after some training and fly straight into the buildings.

The 93 flight is intriguing and poses a problem for the hardcore truthers - in that if it was remote controlled, lets say, then why did it go down? even if you think the voices are not conclusive on cell phone recording. There are many many holes in the full version of the 9/11 truthers. I think the truth lays in the middle, and it's more Chaney/Bush and Friends were accomplices in the attack by way of letting it happen when they could have stopped it. Treason yes. Full on engineering no.

 

[humanoidlord]

The information is available.
Geoengineering Affects You, Your Environment, and Your Loved Ones

use an ubiased source or GTFO

 

[humanoidlord]

Yes, perfect logic there

explain the problems with my theory
bush has always wanted to shove america in other countries face

 

[Area201]

use an ubiased source or GTFO

you use West though. same thing

 

[humanoidlord]

Now I'm often blinded by my own ideas and forget alternatives. It's equally possible that I'm wrong about how this was done Zeke, and that everything else you said is true, just as you've put forward yourself. In fact, in thinking about this for a few minutes it is even more likely that an alternative explanation is more plausible, one which does in fact validate you but also still supports the notion that this was all engineered.

of course it was engineered, but not as drastically as you say
at least you dint bring judy wood (yet!)

 

[humanoidlord]

you use West though. same thing

hes not really biased
there are a bunch of way more biased skeptics

 

[Area201]

hes not really biased
there are a bunch of way more biased skeptics

Really? this guys mission is to debunk everything, specifically geoengineering, but everything. If he's not a shill then that's his schtick. It's pretty even with the two I think as bias goes.

 

[humanoidlord]

Really? this guys mission is to debunk everything, specifically geoengineering, but everything. If he's not a shill then that's his schtick. It's pretty even with the two I think as bias goes.

the only time i dint agree with him was when he tryed to debunk that puerto rico ufo FLIR footage when he said beyond any type of logic that it was an balloon

 

[Area201]

it was an balloon

LOL he really said that? desperate measures, he had nothing.

I remember the thing appeared to go under the surface of the water after splitting in two. Balloon.

 

[humanoidlord]

LOL he really said that? desperate measures, he had nothing.

I remember the thing appeared to go under the surface of the water after splitting in two. Balloon.

yep, to me it was his lowest point ever

 

[Gambeir]

Let me state that one of the reasons I came over to this site was because I was impressed with a lot of your input earlier on various subjects and to get good discussion/debate.

I agree with your sentiments on the terms conspiracy and debunking. I am also somewhat averse to aliens and ufos, but these are the accepted terms used by public and we use for practical measure.

I'm also intrigued with your man-made ufo/alien phenomenon arguments and, even though I think some are actual ET origin, there is room for your practical man-made perspective to fit into the big picture, no doubt. Your ARV insights are very compelling.

So back to 9/11. I'm a "soft truther" or only believe in a "lite" version of the engineering of the events. As such, the deep state behind invading middle east and so on, needed a false flag, saw Bin Laden and his operatives brewing the plan.. and they simply allowed for it to happen, stand down NORAD defense, and earlier helped them with acquiring passports, and so on. I don't see a need for any remote control of the planes, it's not rocket science to get into cockpit after some training and fly straight into the buildings.

The 93 flight is intriguing and poses a problem for the hardcore truthers - in that if it was remote controlled, lets say, then why did it go down? even if you think the voices are not conclusive on cell phone recording. There are many many holes in the full version of the 9/11 truthers. I think the truth lays in the middle, and it's more Chaney/Bush and Friends were accomplices in the attack by way of letting it happen when they could have stopped it. Treason yes. Full on engineering no.

Thanks and sorry for the delay, duty called and I was diverted to the front lines.

Actually I have to thank you for questioning me, and it's good I had a few more moments to think through this more clearly. This was the biggest event in American History since December 7th. I've been too simplistic in my reasoning. Anything this complex could not be either simple, nor leave anything to chance which could otherwise be planned for ahead of time.

Probably we are dealing with not any single explanation but many. It is more probable that the events which took place were real, with real actors, actors in the sense that many were unaware they were actors. There may have also been supporting theactrical devices, which is probably going to prove an error long term, much like the now highly primitive doctored photos distributed after the JFK assassination.

So long story short is I now agree with you in that the people involved, and probably most of the phone calls, maybe not all, were coming from real people. It's likely that given what we now know advanced devices and machines were used to assure a cover story, to assure the aircraft went where intended, and so on and so forth.

As for man made antigravity vehicles of that there is now no doubt whatever. Technically minded people, people versed in physics and materials who've followed me and others, because there are others, do know this is true and they are out there. Hopefully out there working with their own ideas. That was my driving intention because the rest is beyond my pay grade as they say.

I totally agree with you that aliens are here right now and have been for a long time. I seriously doubt their technology is anywhere near as primitive as the ARV, which we may call a second or third generation machine in my opinion.

 

[Gambeir]

So back to 9/11. I don't see a need for any remote control of the planes, it's not rocket science to get into cockpit after some training and fly straight into the buildings.

The 93 flight is intriguing and poses a problem for the hardcore truthers - in that if it was remote controlled, lets say, then why did it go down? even if you think the voices are not conclusive on cell phone recording. There are many many holes in the full version of the 9/11 truthers. I think the truth lays in the middle, and it's more Chaney/Bush and Friends were accomplices in the attack by way of letting it happen when they could have stopped it. Treason yes. Full on engineering no.

Yes and these are strong observations which made me re~thunk my earlier blunderings. I've piloted light planes and sort of piloted a helicopter, which if you can do that you can do anything, so you're right about piloting an airplane. They pretty much fly themselves about 80% of the time anyways. Todays online simulators are so advanced that anyone can learn how to pilot almost any type of flying machine, even helicopter simulators are helpful and time well spent.

Our problem is a human problem and what it really comes down to is wedding ourselves, hence our ego's, to ideas we latch on to. We all do it all the time, but to be a successful investigator you have to just step back and say I might be in error, or I am in error and to take a timeout and start over once again looking for your errors. Doing that isn't too difficult but finding your own oversight is another matter. I tell myself that's why I wear a dunce cap and write what I do, because eventually I hope to find truth and it's my experience that you just cannot do it alone. None of us are that great ~Lol~

So this then does go back to mind control in the broadest sense and also to intimate levels. It's not hard to envision an operation to double cross some fanatics in to doing an operation like 9/11. Toss in the levels of mind control that we know can be achieved with the right targets, and then toss on remote mind control by psychic link, which has been done, and now you've got some serious potential going on.

Exploiting the human potential is really what my mind control thread is about; it's about us realizing that the real dangers which data collection possess, and why face book and those whom are involved in doing data collection are dangerous programs which threaten far more than we are now aware of.

People like Derren Brown have conclusively proven how the right person can be run like human robot, and so now we go back to narrative of "The Men Who Stare At Goats" and find this is all real and was studied intensely. Just like finding suitable fanatics to use for a terrorist plot, what we now find is the psychic warrior story is all about finding the right people to use against the right targets, but that narrative left out the part about remotely hacking a pre~existing pre~programmed tool/s.

If we search for a logical explanation in mass violence incidents today this is going to be the link; this and psychotropic drugs undoubtedly.

So going back to the infamous day in history I see a wider picture and by buying in to one ready made theme or another I'm blinded to the most probable reality where all bases were covered and all available tools were used. In military parlance this would referred to as combined arms strategy.

 

[Castle-Yankee54]

Then West goes into clarify mode:
To clarify, what I was debunking were the claims about this video:

• That it was new (it's seven years old)
• That it's 100% proof of chemtrails (there's no actual evidence in it at all)
• That she's a leaker (She's not a leaker, she has no inside knowledge, she's just a chemtrail believer)
• That she's "addressing the UN". (It's just a conference at the UN).

That video was easy to explain......no need for help.

 

[Area201]

So going back to the infamous day in history I see a wider picture and by buying in to one ready made theme or another I'm blinded to the most probable reality where all bases were covered and all available tools were used. In military parlance this would referred to as combined arms strategy.

Remote control their minds on top of everything else - cover all the bases for guaranteed successful mission execution - gotcha.

There's a possible conflict I'm running into within my own "lite engineering" position.. in my soft truther version, there is no controlled demolition. The series "9/11 debunked" goes over reasons. However, I recently became aware of historical accounts of the 1994 1995 Oklahoma City Bombing which have led me to be suspicious if that was an inside job and makes me reconsider the controlled demolition theory. In that case:

• Found undetonated bombs on site, as witnessed by police.
• Missing video never included in the official investigation of the truck and McVeigh.
• McVeigh was with Person B, which was never followed up.
• The shady death "suicide" of one of the key witnesses to the undetonated bombs on site.
• He was (looks like) recorded on video in a tank on a military base when he was supposed to have been out of service.
• He has letters to sister about working in black ops after failing with main Marines/Military route, maybe recruited.
• ATF office was almost empty that day.

In total puts a whole new spin on the event and looks to me like a False Flag operation to get funding for terrorism now that communism is over, we need a new bad guy. There is none? need to create one - the standard protocol.

In the'95 Bombing there appears to be explosives on site, which were prior to or in combination with McVeigh's Truck bomb. If this is true, then the 9/11 controlled demolition would follow the pattern of making sure the bombing goes off (lets say McVeigh has cold feet or changes his mind or his bomb is too small to cause enough damage). I just don't see how it was necessary for the 9/11 attacks, the damage was unprecedented by the planes, and not a simple building fire.

Now my take on the 1995 OKC Bombing may not be consistent with the 9/11 attacks excluding controlled demolition.. I'm not sure to what degree it was engineered - but it wasn't all the way, and it wasn't anything either - it was something in between. This is Dark Journalism.



After the Bombing, the ATF budget went up 3 times. I guess this should be it's own thread. Do we have one on the 94 '95 bombing? @nivek

 

[nivek]

After the Bombing, the ATF budget went up 3 times. I guess this should be it's own thread. Do we have one on 94 bombing? @nivek

We do not nor is there a 911 thread...yet...

 

[Castle-Yankee54]

We do not nor is there a 911 thread...yet...

That and the OKC bombing was in 1995.......but it appears we need one so we can get back to the topic at hand of contrails.

 

[Area201]

That and the OKC bombing was in 1995.......but it appears we need one so we can get back to the topic at hand of contrails.

damn, for some reason I've been thinking it was in 1994 lol Good catch.

 

[Castle-Yankee54]

damn, for some reason I've been thinking it was in 1994 lol Good catch.

It was 1995.....I remember when it happened and remember McVieghs motivation was the Waco event where the fools set their compound on fire. It was the 2 year anniversary.

 

[Gambeir]

damn, for some reason I've been thinking it was in 1994 lol Good catch.

Yes, we are going off in to the weeds here. Not that there's anything to discuss about chemtrails since you can't even get some people to acknowledge them in the first place, so how then can you move on to the interesting parts of speculating what the end goals are, what the effects might be, what evidence of the effects exist, how this could be all involved with dna tracking, human modification, and on and on.

But of course since we can't even get past the mind control of denial of reality it's pointless to even have the thread IMO.

Now your other material is way cool, and some topics you can't just can isolate but we should move it a conspiracy thread or create one. Maybe entitled "The Enemy Within"

I certainly would enjoy talking about this in the context of an over~arching plot traceable through history and by way of using "Combined Arms Strategy" we can then free range with our thoughts.

 

[Castle-Yankee54]

I agree with your sentiments on the terms conspiracy and debunking. I am also somewhat averse to aliens and ufos, but these are the accepted terms used by public and we use for practical measure.

Who is using debunking for "chemtrails"?.....I'm just looking for good science to be used.