Methods to Combat the COVID-19 Coronavirus

Discussion in 'Present & Current Events' started by Thomas R. Morrison, Mar 15, 2020.

  1. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    I really don't understand this...the WHO has a test for this that only takes a few hours. Apparently the US isn't using it. Wtf is that all about?

    Yes it'll mutate, but no - it's unlikely to mutate into something more deadly. The common cold has been mutating for thousands of years, every year, and yet it's still just an annoyance. The most lethal threats are the ones that suddenly jump species, like this virus did - we have no herd immunity to them so they spread like wildfire through the human population.

    We're lucky that this one only kills less than 3.5% of the infected; it could've been much much worse.
     
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  2. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    I've been meaning to ask, I've been getting a lot of mixed numbers on the mortality rate, Some say 1 percent, others say 3.4 that's a pretty large margin to be undecided upon. So which is more likely the actual mortality rate number?
     
  3. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    Yeah I've been noticing that too. At first I assumed that the World Health Organization had the right answer of 3.4%, but as I've been reading more lately it seems that they're basing their numbers on official cases - that is, people who had had a severe enough problem that they sought medical help. There appears to be a large number of people who don't get very sick and don't seek medical help - they wouldn't get counted in the official number of cases. So depending on the size of that fraction, the number can go down a little bit or by a sizable fraction.

    Which brings us back to the testing problem: hardly anyone is getting tested, because the cheap pricks running our government don't want to spend money on saving millions of people from a lethal virus. Without widespread testing, everyone is guessing at the numbers.

    Also, the mortality rate depends on the hospital care. Iirc, the US has only 95,000 ventilators. So if we end up with 500,000 people in need of ventilators at the same time, the mortality rate will skyrocket.

    Since I'm a cynic and I believe that government incompetence has already doomed us to the worst-case scenario, I'm expecting 50-70% of the population to catch the virus, and 3.4-5% of those people to die because they won't be able to get proper medical treatment, whereas maybe <1% of them would've died if we'd acted when it still mattered.

    The rotten choice that we have now is this: our best hope for saving lives, at this point, is to slow the spread of the virus so our medical infrastructure doesn't get completely overwhelmed all at once. But if we succeed in that, then we'll be dealing with this outbreak for an entire year or more.

    Welcome to the lose-lose scenario.
     
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  4. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    Which brings me to a problem I don't think many have considered. Third world countries. places like Ethiopia and parts of Africa and the middle east are going to be devastated by this.
     
  5. Kchoo

    Kchoo At Peace.

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    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjABegQIChAB&usg=AOvVaw26-g76yUYZ-BAHFSnTVTca


    Two strains of the new coronavirus are spreading around the world, according to an analysis of 103 cases. But the World Health Organization insists that “there is no evidence that the virus has been changing”. So how many strains are there, and why does it matter?

    Viruses are always mutating, especially RNA viruses like this one, coronavirus SARS-CoV-2. When a person is infected with the coronavirus, it replicates in their respiratory tract. Every time it does, around half a dozen genetic mutations occur, says Ian Jones at the University of Reading, UK.



    Read more: Coronavirus: Are there two strains and is one more deadly?
     
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  6. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    Yep. But it doesn't make the news when tens of thousands of people in the third world die every day from preventable hunger and diseases, or from our bombs raining down on their heads, so I doubt we'll hear about their mortalities from the coronavirus either.

    This is a form of the common cold. It'll probably keep mutating, and keep reinfecting people and killing old people - a deadly form of the common cold that keeps coming back year after year after year...

    Too bad medical science can't come up with a cure for the common cold and other coronaviruses - looks to me like life will keep being shittier than ever for the foreseeable future.
     
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  7. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    They don't have to own it. The evidence is clear. It originated from there just like it did in 02 from a wet market.
    It's the kind of thing. The killer goes to court and of course they plead innocent. But The facts are resolute on this.

    Let me explain.

    This video is About eight minutes long. But it explains what Wet markets are and how they spread disease.



    You see bro, They slaughter exotic animals in pits and the blood and ooze and diseases all fester together in these same nasty slaughter pits, literally breeding new diseases.

    They don't have to own this. I'm sure they would love to disown it. But. The truth is, This could have been avoided.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2020
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  8. Kchoo

    Kchoo At Peace.

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    Meh...
    Our president doesn't own his part in it either...
    He is just as much to blame for dismanteling our agencies and strategy councils... as a result, wharehouses and stockpiles were closed.

    Our airlines are at fault for cramming planes too tightly and having too short of a gate turnaround window to clean planes between flights...

    Our hospitals are at fault for reducing inventory.

    Our coleges are at fault for pushing real time ordering as part of sustainability.
    Etc.
    Etc.
     
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  9. Kchoo

    Kchoo At Peace.

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    Trump had many opportunities to buy these tests, but said "no thanks". In the interest of encouraging U.S. Pharmecuetical Companies to profit by creating our own tests. He thought we had plenty of time.

    Now, part of the 50 Billion will go to subsidies to U.S. Pharmecuetical companies...

    But for some reason this almost goes unmentioned by news media.
     
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  10. michael59

    michael59 Celestial

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    So, I read that once you've had it you are immune. Does that just mean if it hasn't mutated?
     
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  11. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    Well, firstly We don't know if people can catch this again or not, However. People can catch other coronaviruses again and again. So If I had to roll a magic eight ball, I would say.

    [​IMG]

    However, Like other diseases, If you catch this, you will then have a certain measure of "immunity to it" Like your body will better be able to fight it off, So it will be less severe. But total immunity, It's just not gonna happen like that.

    Once a vaccine surfaces, one would still not be fully guaranteed to not catch it. They would only be granted a better chance of fighting it off without becoming seriously ill. I realize that the post was directed at Thomas. But, This is a jam I know a little bit about. I had the answer and was around, My bad.
     
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  12. michael59

    michael59 Celestial

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    Have you read that theory about it being Coronavirus causing the deaths of those people who died a while back? You know, the ones they said died because they were vaping? Apparently vaping had nothing to do with the cause of death. We just didn't know what Coronavirus was yet..
     
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  13. AlienView

    AlienView Honorable

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    Vitamin C and SARS coronavirus
    Harri Hemilä
    Journal of Antimicrobial Chemotherapy, Volume 52, Issue 6, December 2003, Pages 1049–1050, Vitamin C and SARS coronavirus

    "Recently, a new coronavirus was identified as the cause of the severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS).1 In the absence of a specific treatment for SARS, the possibility that vitamin C may show non-specific effects on severe viral respiratory tract infections should be considered. There are numerous reports indicating that vitamin C may affect the immune system,2,3 for example the function of phagocytes, transformation of T lymphocytes and production of interferon. In particular, vitamin C increased the resistance of chick embryo tracheal organ cultures to infection caused by an avian coronavirus.4 Studies in animals found that vitamin C modifies susceptibility to various bacterial and viral infections,3 for example protecting broiler chicks against an avian coronavirus.5 Placebo-controlled trials have shown quite consistently that the duration and severity of common cold episodes are reduced in the vitamin C groups,3 indicating that viral respiratory infections in humans are affected by vitamin C levels. There is also evidence indicating that vitamin C may affect pneumonia.3 In particular, three controlled trials with human subjects reported a significantly lower incidence of pneumonia in vitamin C-supplemented groups,6 suggesting that vitamin C may affect susceptibility to lower respiratory tract infections under certain conditions. The possibility that vitamin C affects severe viral respiratory tract infections would seem to warrant further study, especially in light of the recent SARS epidemic."

    Quote Source:
    Vitamin C and SARS coronavirus


    NOTE: This is an old article - In China today they are again testing the efficacy of Vitamin C on the current
    pandemic.

    Also note, there is little money to be made in promoting vitamin C - Don't expect the mainstream media
    to be talking about it except maybe to debunk it - Don't expect any cure that is cheap
    - While there is big money to be made by big pharma on vaccines and expensive cures








     
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  14. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    Yes. It's like the common cold in that way - once you've beaten a strain of the common cold, you'll never come down with that strain of the cold again (unless you become severely immunocompromised). But most of us have had more than one cold in our lifetimes because new strains arise rapidly...like every year rapidly.

    A recent paper by Chinese researchers asserts that there are two strains of this new coronavirus, an "S" strain and an "L" strain. They seem to think that you can get infected by both strains at the same time:

    "A controversial research paper claims the new coronavirus has split into two distinct strains and that it is possible to be infected with both, but some experts are unconvinced." March 5, 2020
    Coronavirus researchers claim virus has split into two strains, but many experts disagree

    It's still unclear if a patient can catch one strain, beat it, and then catch the second strain. Or if patients will have a higher mortality rate if they become infected with both strains. And that's a hugely important question. But we can't answer these questions yet - typically one paper does not a scientific fact make; lots of individual papers have been wrong in the long march of science, and some experts have been grousing about the quality of that research paper.

    So all we can say at the moment is that there might be effectively two strains of this virus, and that might be significant.

    But here's a worrying thing: the more people this virus infects, the higher the chances that it will mutate enough that the body's immune response to one strain won't work against the new strain. And, like the common cold, there's a very good chance that this will indeed happen over time, and we could see an entirely new strain of this thing every year, just like the common cold....except more deadly.
     
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  15. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    This sounds like BS to me. The new coronavirus is extremely contagious - if those vapers had caught this virus, outbreaks would've rapidly spread to everyone around them and they would've been identified as "patient zeros" by the CDC. That didn't happen. In fact, that was months ago, long before the Wuhan outbreak. If this thing had been in the US way back then, we would've been the first country overrun with this virus last year, not China.
     
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  16. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    Can You Get Coronavirus Twice? How Long Are You Immune After COVID-19?


    Expert: Recovered coronavirus patients are still prone to reinfection


    Japanese woman tests positive for coronavirus for 2nd time, weeks after initial recovery

    Can You Catch the Same Cold or Flu Twice?


    With all the good news that's been floating around about the pandemic slowing in China and the mortality rate being lower than initially thought. I think I'm beginning to come out of my panic. It's relieving.

     
  17. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    That may be the worst article I've ever read. It's 2-3 times longer than it needs to be because he spends most of his effort inserting stupid cutesy pop culture references into it that he thinks are witty. And every possibility that he raises, he then retracts "might be this...or then again it might be that." Worthless rubbish.

    But I did learn that the immunity to the original SARS only lasts a couple of years - I wasn't aware of that. And yes, that's terrible news - if the same applies to this virus, then we could all get the same virus every couple of years even if it doesn't mutate appreciably. But then again, we don't know if the immune response to this virus is like the response to that virus, yet.

    As that awful Bruce Y. Lee article in Forbes mentioned, both of those cases could be attributable to false negative tests. Remember: this virus has only been around since about Dec. 1, 2019 - the tests are far from reliable at this point. They've been running 3-4 tests per patient because the test is so unreliable.

    This is why you should never do research using YouTube videos - this clip says that you can catch the same cold twice. Then he explains that you can only get it again after it mutates. That's not the same virus - it's a new strain. That was my whole point - it's the mutations that find ways around our earlier immunity. And viruses mutate constantly.


    It's almost always a bad idea to panic, so I'm glad you're coming to grips with all of this. But you're also in the high risk group, so don't get too complacent - we're all going to have to be very smart and thorough with our safety and decon measures for many months, possibly even a year or more. One lapse of attention and a stranger's cough in your face can undo months of careful measures. So don't panic, but be consistently prudent....we want to keep you around for a good long while for a whole lot of cool conversations over the years ahead, amigo.
     
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  18. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    Actually there is a window period shortly after a cold or flu that you can require the same infection, It's rare though.

    I can't really Quote all my sources, But studying this has been my life for the past month, I heard somewhere all the family of coronaviruses can be required. There is no Broadscale immunity to this. Only less severe symptoms, So while there is a certain measure of immunity, It's wise to explain to people that "Immunity" Does not mean completely immune in most cases. I wish I could remember my source on that. There has been so much study I've done on this.

    If I am not mistaken, It was a CNN interview with that Faloichi guy.

    To be fair, there is a lot about the particulars of Coivd-19 that we just don't know yet.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2020
  19. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Administrator

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    Nobody has any level of immunity to this virus - it's unlike all of the earlier coronaviruses. That's one of the main reasons why it's spreading like wildfire all over the globe.

    With the earlier coronaviruses, they often share similarities with earlier strains that can confer a partial immunity to some new strains. That doesn't seem to apply to this one, according to all of the virologists I've seen interviewed in articles on this. But some people have very robust, fast-acting immune systems - kids for example. So when they get infected with this thing, there's enough latency time for their bodies to mount an effective immune response, and they get moderate if any symptoms. Old people's immune systems aren't so spry, so old people have trouble mounting a defense before this little bastard shreds their lungs cells.
     
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  20. Shadowprophet

    Shadowprophet Truthiness

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    To my knowledge, This Version os Sars is less lethal than other variations. I'm not sure if that's something they say to keep panic down, or if it's the legit gospel, But Sars-Cov2. Or covid-19 is supposed to be somewhat Tamer than the Sars-cov1 that swept across Singapore in 02-04
     
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