The Lounge

Discussion in 'Social Place' started by nivek, Aug 20, 2017.

  1. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    @The shadow
    I have been laid off twice.... I found out in both cases they planned it from the beginning. Both times, they hired to build an internal project, and planned to lay off everyone after they got what they needed.

    Even after proving to be a perfect employee, bean counters didn’t see anything but numbers on paper, and the managers had no new ideas that required my type of genius, or so they thought....
    So they cleaned house. The first time I had another better paying job within two weeks. It lasted 7 years, after which I immediately went to work for myself doing contract work.

    Both companies had the plan to use overseas cheap ass consultants to maintain the system, and within 6 months, both companies realized they made a mistake. When they offered me my job back, the conversations were so similar for each, I only need to present it once, my first question was “For how long?”

    Neither would answer that question, so I told them the contract would require a parachute of 2 years of severance immediately after walking in the door. So if they laid me off at anytime I would get my parachute.
    “Never mind.” they said, “We can’t do that.”

    Me, “We had a good thing going. I trusted you. You should have given me more consideration. I am sorry that your vision was short sited, but now that is what it will take to bring me back. Meanwhile, good luck. I wish you all the best that life can offer without me. I knew your company well... now you have to start over training someone new.”

    Them, “I will forward your message.”

    Me, “The only message to forward is “Thank you.” because I leaped forward. The experienced I gained is golden.”
    (I knew that would get them.)

    Them, “Have a nice day. If you change your mind, you know how to reach us.”

    Me, “You called me. Thank you for your call. If you change your mind, you know where you can reach me.”

    And no, I did not hear back from them. I didn’t expect them to give in to my demand, because while mildly painful, I knew I had left them in a good spot. They really didn’t need me long term in that role, and they were laying off a few middle managers, so it wasn’t going to be a manager role or they would have taken my contract.

    The point is, never look back, always make it work in your favor, and manifest a better leap forward, you had 14 years at that company, your experience is golden! You deserve a leap forward.
     
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  2. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

    Messages:
    9,722
    Well, asking for a 2 year severance is way too much to ask any company for hourly employees or salary for that matter...I know of no company who would do that...

    ...
     
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  3. The shadow

    The shadow The shadow knows!

    Messages:
    1,435
    my former manager is working on a severance for us. I have no idea how much.
     
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  4. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

    Messages:
    9,722
    I've heard of a 6 month severance pay many times and a couple times I've heard of a year severance but not sure what those positions in the company were to get that...I have never heard of a 2 year severance pay...

    ...
     
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  5. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

    Messages:
    638
    There are some things totally unrelated to this thread or AE this morning that have my anger and bitterness over being laid off absolutely piqued. I had one really, really good job for most of my life and miss it terribly and this morning I had a gratuitous reminder.

    I think it might've been better for me overall to have changed jobs at least a couple of times in that period. Difficult to watch the machine roll on without you and impossible not to be very, very angry. Did I mention very?

    Severance - capped at 6 months for long term employees. Those left now will be lucky to get two weeks.
     
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  6. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

    Messages:
    9,722
    Totally related to this thread IMO, which is all things personal in nature if'n one chooses to share...:)

    ...
     
  7. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

    Messages:
    638
    Well, yeah. You are correct for calling bullshit on that :)

    The post I made on Friday @ 15:28 was sincere. When I share personal things generally I try to keep it light - hobbies, pets, etc. Reading about the Shadow's layoff hit close to home and I was trying to paraphrase the Stones by saying that you can get what you need and in the end it'll be OK. Having just been through my version that and coming out the other end of the pipe it seemed relevant.

    This morning, unrelated to that post or AE, I was gratuitously given some information about my old company and job that I really didn't need to hear - and this thread provided a cathartic spot to vent. The anger, frustration and hard feelings are very close to the surface and after a 32 year run probably will be for quite some time. I wanted to light the flaming sword, scream jihad and lop off a few heads. Cry havoc and let loose the dogs of war, yada yada yada.

    Hiking with Mrs. Pigfarmer and our schweinhund dialed me back in and I feel much better. I may nip off to the garage and squeeze my head in a bench vice for a few minutes, but have moved past most of it ....
     
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  8. Standingstones

    Standingstones See you in heaven, if you make the list.

    Messages:
    853
    I learned a hard lesson at a previous job I worked at many years past. Management gathered all the workers together for an impromptu meeting. We were told that the company was building a brand new factory in Mexico.

    They told us that if we didn't buckle down, shape up
    and do better work they would close the US plant and send all the work down south of the border. It was a forgone conclusion in my mind that we were soon finished. I began to look for a new job immediately. I soon left and sure enough they closed down the US operations.

    You always have to look out for number one and be ready for stuff like this.
     
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  9. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    Well, asking for a 2 year severance is way too much to ask any company for hourly employees or salary for that matter...I know of no company who would do that


    True, it worked a lot better when researched the market and came armed with the real numbers and a real desire with reasons to back it. It was reasonable, and it was a win win. Money was not the only thing I looked at... I turned down a couple of better sounding offers money wise, but I found a work family. Not some mantra, but real friends who I have and will remained friends with.
     
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  10. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    q50
    Flu shot this morn... took 6 hours to start a mild fever... no pain in the shoulder yet...

    Took two and will check in tomorrow.
     
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  11. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    Fever seems to have broken as of 13 hours.
    The Alleve helped, but I tossed around a bit... breakfast TIME!
     
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  12. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

    Messages:
    9,722
    Another 14 hour day at work but the maple vanity job is completed and on the truck heading for Texas...

    I'm very tired, going to sleep early tonight...

    ...
     
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  13. The shadow

    The shadow The shadow knows!

    Messages:
    1,435
    almost a week now..
    6 apps out.
    am trying to be positive but I'm depressed. I have no clue how much severance I will get. what to get that's fair. how much for 14 years of loyalty.
    how much is my dedication worth?
    I don't know..
     
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  14. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    That raises a red flag... I think you should have been given severence contract with an amount and date of arrival of the check at the time of notice.

    Talk to an employment law expert ASAP. Give them any papers to review before signing anything.

    Often they will charge a flat rate just to let the company know they are involved, but they may he able to do quite a bit with a single phone call.

    You are not suing, just getting council advocacy and being informed of what you are, or are not legally entitled to in your state.
     
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  15. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    Also, don’t be depressed. Dude, the world is yours. Just open as many doors as you can.

    Someone will pick you up. 14 years of experience at the same company speaks volumes for you. You are Prime Candidate stuff based on that alone!
    :yes3:

    Remember, you deserve a raise, if you can get it, as well as more vacation. Do not accept the first offer... be reasonable, but open on what your desired should be based on experience and market research. Politely explain that you are a reasonable adult, but you have children, and you are looking for a long term arrangement for them. Give them a ‘desired salary’ and vacation that you consider fair and ideal for your long term satisfaction. Because everyone knows family matters and if the family likes your arrangement, it’s a win win. Sell it. It’s an easy sale because it is honest truth.

    They may say they can’t do that...so ask them what they can do... it will usually turn out better than the first offer.

    Once you accept, you need to be able to say with honesty that you think y’all are both in a good arrangement for long term success.
     
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  16. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

    Messages:
    9,722
    Severance pay is not an entitlement, its up to each individual business to offer that perk or not...Some companies do, some do not, none are obligated to provide that...

    ...
     
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  17. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    True. But there is what is legally right, and then there is what is humanly correct as well.

    It sounds like he was told he would get a severance payment but he was not told when to expect it or what it would be. A persons security is important, and a company should be serious about lessening stresses during his transition.

    So, it sounds like he needs some advocacy because the company appears to have little at this time. He has toiled and sacrificed for them for 14 years, and I think anyone who does that deserves a nice bonus as they send him on his way. Especially if it was a layoff through no fault of his own. It is doubtful he could have remained employeed for 14 years if he was anything but a fine employee so firing him doesn’t sound very realistic. Even then he should recieve something to help him on his way.

    I doubt a company that employs someone for that long would try to throw him to the curb, but council may help him have the peace of mind that at least he isn’t going to be lied to going forward.

    Whether he gets council or not, is up to him, as it will be out his pocket.

    The company should have prepared him better. Leaving him hanging or not knowing is way out of balance.

    He needs some reassurance that he will know how much time he will have to find a new job with the least amount to expect and a date of when that check will arrive and if none, they should have made that clear at the time of notice, and in writing.
     
  18. Sheltie

    Sheltie Noble

    Messages:
    720
    I've been laid off several times over the years and it's my understanding that companies are not required to pay severance. As far as I know, at least in the state where I live, you are entitled to unemployment compensation for a specified period as long as you are actively seeking work. You should register with your state employment commission asap.
     
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  19. Kchoo

    Kchoo Celestial

    Messages:
    1,584
    After 14 years, I would expect them to be nice on the way out.

    It isn't unreasonable to expect something nice for a bon voyage. Especialy after 14 years.

    I think it would be pretty dang impolite to let someone give 14 years of their life to a company without a decent parting gift.

    I also think it is sad that people shrug it off like it is no big deal.
    To that I say "Harumph".

    14 years IS a big deal.
     
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  20. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

    Messages:
    9,722
    I see what you're saying and ideally and morally you are correct but in reality we simply cannot expect such things, to expect it is to have an entitlement mentality which is not constructive nor helpful, one must accept the reality of the situation and move forward...

    ...
     
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