To The Stars Academy: Investigating the Unexplained

Discussion in 'UFOs & Sightings' started by nivek, Feb 9, 2019.

  1. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    Best of luck with all that. I'm sure any day now........
     
  2. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Unapologetic Rationalist & Grand Inquisitor

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    This just in from John Greenewald, Jr.:

    "U.S. Navy Confirms Videos Depict ‘Unidentified Aerial Phenomena’

    The Navy designates the objects contained in these videos as unidentified aerial phenomena,” said Joseph Gradisher, official spokesperson for the Deputy Chief of Naval Operations for Information Warfare. When asked why the phrase “UAP” is now utilized by the U.S. Navy, and not “UFO,” Mr. Gradisher added, “The ‘Unidentified Aerial Phenomena’ terminology is used because it provides the basic descriptor for the sightings/observations of unauthorized/unidentified aircraft/objects that have been observed entering/operating in the airspace of various military-controlled training ranges.”
    U.S. Navy Confirms Videos Depict ‘Unidentified Aerial Phenomena’; Not Cleared For Public Release

    Unfortunately, instead of focusing on the landslide admission by the Navy that the three videos depict legit UAP craft, John chooses to whine about the fact that they went through an unconventional public release process...but it's a big story if you ignore his pathological and infantile bias against these folks. The US Navy just publicly admitted that UAP are real, and operating over our military ranges: that's huge.
     
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  3. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    An intelligence officer has provided these three videos and their provenance is in question.
    In other arenas accepting that sort of thing and overlooking various discrepancies would be seen as a farce.

    TTSA is furnishing all the traction people like JG need. Their inability to coordinate their messaging and clear up the many questions that surround all this is to the point that I actually think that discord and chaos must be what they're after.

    Unless they can actually show where the hell these videos came from and provide some verifiable detail they'll remain (to me) curiosities in the same filing cabinet drawer as the MJ12 documents. You know - the ones that people still think were real.

    OK. UAP. New guidelines. Didn't JG find an old Air Force manual that had a chapter regarding UAP contact reporting? Subsequently edited after his discovery.
     
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  4. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    I would think JG could have been more mature and taken the big news from the Navy as the big news it is but instead he uses that report to further attack TTSA...

    ...
     
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  5. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Unapologetic Rationalist & Grand Inquisitor

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    Technically speaking Luis Elizondo was a counterintelligence agent during his time in the military. This isn't particularly suspicious - most counterintelligence work (about >98%) of it, involves protecting our intelligence from hostile actors; for example, keeping ISIS from finding out our troop movements so our soldiers don't stroll into a mine field on their way to an assignment.

    After his military service, Elizondo was asked to replace the director of the AAWSAP, at which time the program bega to function under the unofficial moniker of the AATIP. In this capacity he functioned as a manager and an intelligence analyst, which is what is required to investigate an unidentified potential adversary.

    Clearly the videos were taken by US military gun camera pods, and their provenance has been confirmed by multiple credible witnesses involved in the incidents. And now the US Navy has officially confirmed their provenance, and taken the further remarkable step of designating them as UAP which have intruded into our active military airspace.

    So I fail to see, at this point, in what sense their provenance can be reasonably called into question.

    Regarding the declassification and release process, the recently released emails detailing all of that have been made public. It's unclear whether you're unaware of this, or if you're being deliberately obtuse about it. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you haven't been keeping up with recent developments, but JG must be aware of them and deliberately pretending they haven't happened, to sow further discord.

    The DoD itself is the source of many contradictory statements, so I think you're pointing the finger at the wrong people.

    The pilots involved in the incidents saw the original hi-res footage and they've confirmed that the clips originated from those events. We have the emails detailing the declassification and public release process. And now the US Navy itself has confirmed not only the provenance of the videos but has also officially and publicly designated them as legit videos of UAP incidents. Seriously - what more could anyone possibly want at this point? The level of confirmation here is astonishing and unprecedented. I guess some folks just love to be intransigent.

    Yeah, that was good work. But those old guidelines sent all of the data into a black box; the new guidelines seem to indicate a more open and transparent posture, which is good, because that data needs to be made available to Congress if we're ever going to see a loosening of the extreme secrecy that has shrouded this topic for over 70 years.
     
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  6. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    Yes JG must be aware and yes I am certain he is deliberately sowing discontent and dividing people, even Jack Brewer has been passive aggressively campaigning for JG, calling themselves the minority on the right side...I don't understand why they are choosing any 'sides', we all want the truth about these UFOs/UAPs, its like they're going around with a knife stabbing at anyone and everything they don't agree with, especially at all things TTSA...Very closed minded in their approach...

    ...
     
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  7. Spaceman spiff

    Spaceman spiff Honorable

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    Noticed that whenever news comes about AATIP and TTSA, both the supporters and the opposition find something new to grasp to that supports their narratives and the dance continues. Around we go again...
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019 at 7:05 PM
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  8. Double Nought Spy

    Double Nought Spy Easily Amused

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    I'm not surprised by people like Brewer making snide remarks and generally being a wet blanket. He is heavily invested in UFOs in general being anything other than something from elsewhere. He would probably try to deny that, but it's painfully obvious in his rhetoric and his approach to anything unexplained. It's kind of sad that we need people like him calling bullshit on the really stupid stuff, but that's the lay of the land.

    Greenwald needs to grow up if he wants anyone to take him seriously.
     
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  9. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    Something like this: :)

    A pair in motion

    ...
     
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  10. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    :)

    Ahhh, always the diplomat ......
    yes that must be it.
     
  11. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Unapologetic Rationalist & Grand Inquisitor

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    Literally the very next sentence states:

    If you find that you're still offended after being given the benefit of the doubt, then the problem is yours, not mine.

    I'm here to speak honestly and directly, and to argue my position logically and with cited facts. The upside of this stance is that nobody ever has to wonder whether I'm kissing their ass by being "politically correct," because I don't play that game.
     
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  12. pigfarmer

    pigfarmer tall, thin, irritable

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    If I were offended and felt the need to express it here nobody would be in doubt. So no, I'm no I'm not.
    We are on opposite sides of this and will apparently remain so. And we're far from being alone in that. We could be in a forum dedicated to collector spoons or baking muffins and their threads rise to an equal pitch on certain topics.

    As for speaking directly, well, there are many ways to express an opinion. Some better than others.
     
  13. Dean

    Dean Adept Dabbler

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    In a post on his website on September 11, 2019, John Greenewald Jr. published some additional statements that he has received from Joseph Gradisher. Mr. Gradisher, a retired USN captain, is official spokesperson for the Deputy Chief of Naval Operations for Information Warfare (OPNAV N2/N6), who is also the Director of Naval Intelligence. Since June 2018, those coupled positions have been held by Rear Admiral (three-star) Matthew J. Kohler.

    In the Sept. 11 article, Mr. Greenewald attributes the following new direct quotes to Mr. Gradisher:

    -- “The Navy’s official identifiers for the referenced videos do not match the names referenced (FLIR1, Gimbal and GoFast). . . the Navy identifies these videos by the respective dates of the observations/sightings . . . [The] dates are 14 November 2004 for ‘FLIR1’ and 21 January 2015 for both ‘Gimbal’ and ‘GoFast.’”

    -- “The Navy has not publicly released characterizations or descriptions, nor released any hypothesis or conclusions, in regard to the objects contained in the referenced videos.”

    -- “The Navy considers the phenomena contained/depicted in those 3 videos as unidentified."

    The complete September 11 Greenewald post is here.
     
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  14. Dean

    Dean Adept Dabbler

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    A bit higher up in this thread, Thomas R. Morrison summarized an article published on Sept. 10, 2019, by John Greenewald Jr., owner of the website TheBlackVault.com, under the headline, "U.S. Navy Confirms Videos Depict ‘Unidentified Aerial Phenomena’." The Greenewald article contained several noteworthy quotes from Joseph Gradisher, spokesman for the office of the Deputy Chief of Naval Operations for Information Warfare.

    I subsequently asked Mr. Gradisher if he would provide me with a single uninterrupted statement on the same points, with the understanding that I would pass it on intact to other interested persons. Today (9-12-19) Mr. Gradisher responded. He said, "Mr. Greenewald did indeed quote me accurately in his recent [Sept. 10] article." Mr. Gradisher also provided an integrated statement, which I reproduce below and in the attached graphic. It contains a couple of explanatory clauses not found in the Greenewald article.

    The compete Joseph Gradisher statement to me (9-12-19) follows:

    "The U.S. Navy designates the objects contained in the 3 range-incursion videos that are currently being referred to in various media as unidentified aerial phenomena. The 'Unidentified Aerial Phenomena’' terminology is used because it provides the basic descriptor for the sightings/observations of unauthorized/unidentified aircraft/objects that have been observed entering/operating in the airspace of various military-controlled training ranges -- it’s any aerial phenomenon that cannot immediately be identified. 'Unidentified Aerial Phenomena (UAP)' is a term we borrowed from the UK. The Navy has not released those videos to the general public, nor authorized public release. The three videos were/are designated as unclassified." [end, Gradisher statement of 9-12-19]​

    Note: The Deputy Chief of Naval Operations for Information Warfare (OPNAV N2/N6) is a three-star admiral, who is also the Director of Naval Intelligence. Since June 2018, those coupled positions have been held by Rear Admiral Matthew J. Kohler.

    As I noted earlier in this thread, on Sept. 11, 2019, Mr. Greenewald published a second article that quoted Mr. Gradisher on a few additional points of information, including the date on which each of the three videos was taken.
     

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  15. Thomas R. Morrison

    Thomas R. Morrison Unapologetic Rationalist & Grand Inquisitor

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    Holy smokes - magnificent work Dean. This kind of original and substantive research elevates the discussion at these forums to a whole new level.

    So to paraphrase, the US Navy is saying "the three videos are ours and unclassified and we use the following encounter dates to refer to them, and they show unidentified devices/objects operating within our military-controlled airspace...but we didn't release the videos or authorize them for release, and although we're calling them 'UAP,' we're not officially designating them or classifying them in any way whatsoever (even though we just did by calling them UAP in the first place)."

    That certainly settles the provenance question, but the back-peddling about the significance of the UAP designation is a bit disappointing.

    It would be nice if we could see the intelligence analyses of the videos, so we could hear from the Navy exactly what speeds and accelerations and other pertinent performance characteristics they determined for these devices. But apparently they're not ready to come clean about that kind of data yet.
     
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  16. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    The news continues to open up more discussion and talks on these UAPs/UFOs...

    A 'turning point' on UFOs: Physicist Michio Kaku tells ufology conference the truth is out there

    BARCELONA, Spain — For the often-ridiculed followers of ufology, the study of unidentified flying objects, there was a sense of validation when the celebrated physicist and author Michio Kaku took a break from his work on string field theory to address the Ufology World Congress here last weekend and offer some advice on how to behave aboard an alien spaceship.

    “For God’s sake, steal something!” he exhorted the audience of 1,000 at the Hesperia Barcelona Tower hotel, famous for its spaceship bar perched off the 29th floor. Kaku said a pocketed alien paper clip, alien fork, even a bit of “alien dandruff” would yield useful chemical and genetic information to scientists.

    [​IMG]
    Michio Kaku speaks at the Ufology World Congress in Barcelona, Spain, on Sept. 7.

    It is, of course, a matter of speculation whether extraterrestrials have hair, let alone dandruff. Drawings based on the descriptions of people who claim to have seen them typically depict them as bald, although there is also believed to be a race of blond humanoid aliens known as “Nordics.”


    Kaku, a well-known science writer, media personality and professor of theoretical physics at the City University of New York Graduate Center, also spoke to Yahoo News about assorted planetary matters, including his concerns about a future traffic jam in orbits around the moon, in a separate interview.

    [​IMG]
    View of the Hesperia Barcelona Tower hotel, the site of the Ufology World Congress.

    Even without extraterrestrial dandruff to analyze, the field of astrobiology, the study of life outside Earth, has been invigorated recently by some provocative findings released over the past 20 months. Researchers have been poring over recently declassified videos shot by U.S. Navy pilots over the East Coast in 2015, showing mysterious flying objects that behave like no known aircraft. Thanks to newly updated radar systems in Navy jets, the videos have aided scientists by providing “testability” and previously unknown metrics about UFOs. “We now know they fly between Mach 5 and Mach 20 — five to 20 times the speed of sound,” Kaku said. “We know they zigzag so fast that any pilot would be crushed by centrifugal force. That they have no exhaust that we can see.” The explanations usually invoked for UFO sightings — meteors, weather balloons, even the planet Venus — can’t explain these live-action high-precision shots, said Kaku, leading to either of two possible conclusions: They are of human origin, representing a technology so cutting-edge that even leading scientists are puzzled by it. Or, he said, “maybe they are evidence of an advanced outer space civilization.”


    Could they be Russian, not Martian? Perhaps, Kaku allowed, given that last year Russian President Vladimir Putin announced that “Russia had built a hypersonic flying vehicle that can zigzag.” The U.S. and China are also working on hypersonic drones. On the other hand, Kaku emphasized, “maybe they are extraterrestrial.” After all, he noted, the universe is 13.8 billion years old, while earthly science was born merely 300 years ago; on any of 4,000 recently discovered exoplanets, where life as we know it might be able to exist, alien civilizations may well have had much longer to advance their scientific and technological skills.

    (more on the link)

    .
     
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  17. Dejan Corovic

    Dejan Corovic Honorable

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    Wow, that is semi-official acknowledgement from mainstream.
     
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  18. Spaceman spiff

    Spaceman spiff Honorable

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    Kaku is one of the more open minded science populizers on this subject, too bad hes an anomaly still among them all. Tyson, Nye, Shostak.... not so much. They take the safe position.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019 at 5:47 PM
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  19. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    [​IMG]
     
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  20. nivek

    nivek As Above So Below

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    John Greenewald is going to be on Coast to Coast AM tomorrow night with Jimmy Church...

    I wonder what they will be talking about...:Whistle:

    Coast to Coast AM

    ...
     
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