Unofficial Military (and other cool) Stuff Thread
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
The Russkies were even clumsier and ineffective then than they are now they but they most certainly do know what they are doing. Challenging the guy who owns the pool table to a game generally doesn't work out too wellIts not that Fins know what they are doing, its that Russians don't have clue
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
British guy documentary, normally I say 'excellent' except for whatever reason James Holland irritates me. Perhaps overuse of the phrase 'rough and ready' and how he seems to be distracted when his host is speaking. That aside as a time waster with some judicious fast forwarding this was pretty interesting. I hadn't realized the innards of those things were as dangerous o the occupants as they are but as is mentioned, that's Russins for you.
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
I remember watching another video documentary about WW2 tanks and they had driven a Tiger and T-34.
Basically, Tiger sound like a house on wheels, and T-34 sounded like a tin can on wheels. I think just that sound tells one everything about the build quality of the first one vs other one.
I think T-34s outnumbered Tigers something like 7 or 8 to 1. Quantity was the only quality they had.
Basically, Tiger sound like a house on wheels, and T-34 sounded like a tin can on wheels. I think just that sound tells one everything about the build quality of the first one vs other one.
I think T-34s outnumbered Tigers something like 7 or 8 to 1. Quantity was the only quality they had.
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
A quick Wiki check would have solved this half century plus old mystery for me but I never bothered.
Ever have something indelibly imprinted in your mind that just pops up? As I was watching that episode about the T-34 they pointed out that the original version's main gun was a 76.2mm later upgraded to a 85mm. With a Wham-O worthy of the old Batman series a vivid image from an old comic book appeared in my head unbidden and a childhood mystery was solved.
DC Comics The Haunted Tank was one of my favorites. The spirit of Confederate Gen. J.E.B Stuart adopts a namesake M3 Stuart light tank because the sergeant commanding it is also his namesake. Problem is Sgt. J.E.B Stuart is a damned Yankee (like me) and he's not too happy about it. The tank goes on to many adventures and when it's finally destroyed they cannibalize a 'jigsaw tank'. There is a panel seared into my memory from that issue about them adding a '76.2mm gun' that I never understood. Never knew what the hell it was. My (fortunately) brief experience with a stepfather added no clarity - he was in the Marines and was an M60 tanker. He had no clue, never heard of it.
So yesterday I finally figured out they cannibalized a T-34. If you think it took forever for me to explain something that trivial try waiting 50+ years for the answer I didn't even know I'd remembered that stuff but yup, plain as day it's still in there. I'm going to try to track that panel down.
Ever have something indelibly imprinted in your mind that just pops up? As I was watching that episode about the T-34 they pointed out that the original version's main gun was a 76.2mm later upgraded to a 85mm. With a Wham-O worthy of the old Batman series a vivid image from an old comic book appeared in my head unbidden and a childhood mystery was solved.
DC Comics The Haunted Tank was one of my favorites. The spirit of Confederate Gen. J.E.B Stuart adopts a namesake M3 Stuart light tank because the sergeant commanding it is also his namesake. Problem is Sgt. J.E.B Stuart is a damned Yankee (like me) and he's not too happy about it. The tank goes on to many adventures and when it's finally destroyed they cannibalize a 'jigsaw tank'. There is a panel seared into my memory from that issue about them adding a '76.2mm gun' that I never understood. Never knew what the hell it was. My (fortunately) brief experience with a stepfather added no clarity - he was in the Marines and was an M60 tanker. He had no clue, never heard of it.
So yesterday I finally figured out they cannibalized a T-34. If you think it took forever for me to explain something that trivial try waiting 50+ years for the answer
I didn't even know I'd remembered that stuff but yup, plain as day it's still in there. I'm going to try to track that panel down.
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
Watch that video - it has some interesting commentary on that. Specifically there was a (I assume documented, who knows) incident with a single T-34-85 and three Royal Tigers. Spoiler alert - doesn't end well for The Hun.
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
Yup. I have a couple of trade paperbacks with these old DC comics and it didn't take long to find this. This would make a pretty good movie - a Fury with a paranormal twist.
** an interesting commentary on the fallibility of human memory. Yup, mine was pretty good and pulled something out from a long time ago but the actual panel itself that spurred this peculiar memory didn't really look the way I remembered it, yet there it was. Ok for comic books but if we are talking alien spaceships then well, maybe we want to set the standard a bit higher. **
Death of the Haunted Tank
** an interesting commentary on the fallibility of human memory. Yup, mine was pretty good and pulled something out from a long time ago but the actual panel itself that spurred this peculiar memory didn't really look the way I remembered it, yet there it was. Ok for comic books but if we are talking alien spaceships then well, maybe we want to set the standard a bit higher. **
Death of the Haunted Tank
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
OK, here are some important points.
1.) Tiger can penetrate T-34's armour from 1,500 m away, In return, T-34 can penetrate Tiger's armour from 500 m. So, penetration distance difference was 1,000 m.
2.) Tiger can shoot approximately 5 rounds/minute, but it took T-34 about a minute to cross 1,000 m ( the difference in penetration distances ). So, scientifically speaking, it took 6 T-34s to destroy one Tiger. That's actually confirmed by real war stats, it took 5 T-34 to destroy 1 Tiger.
3.) Tiger had optical gunsights, not very different from riflescope with gratings. T-34 didn't have any optics. They had a rifle mounted next to the gun and rifle's bullet had same ballistics characteristics as a gun. So, T-34's crew would stop the tank, fire a rifle with a tracer bullet, gauge overshoot/undershoot, and finally load live round into the gun. No wander Tigers destroyed so many T-34s.
All the above dictated Soviet tactics. After spotting Germans, Soviets would run, as fast as they could, all the T-34s towards Tigers in a hope that the last T-34s will come close enough to Tigers to penetrate them.
Curiosity, T-34's cannon was designed by German company Krupp before WW2, while Nazis and Commies were best friends.
1.) Tiger can penetrate T-34's armour from 1,500 m away, In return, T-34 can penetrate Tiger's armour from 500 m. So, penetration distance difference was 1,000 m.
2.) Tiger can shoot approximately 5 rounds/minute, but it took T-34 about a minute to cross 1,000 m ( the difference in penetration distances ). So, scientifically speaking, it took 6 T-34s to destroy one Tiger. That's actually confirmed by real war stats, it took 5 T-34 to destroy 1 Tiger.
3.) Tiger had optical gunsights, not very different from riflescope with gratings. T-34 didn't have any optics. They had a rifle mounted next to the gun and rifle's bullet had same ballistics characteristics as a gun. So, T-34's crew would stop the tank, fire a rifle with a tracer bullet, gauge overshoot/undershoot, and finally load live round into the gun. No wander Tigers destroyed so many T-34s.
All the above dictated Soviet tactics. After spotting Germans, Soviets would run, as fast as they could, all the T-34s towards Tigers in a hope that the last T-34s will come close enough to Tigers to penetrate them.
Curiosity, T-34's cannon was designed by German company Krupp before WW2, while Nazis and Commies were best friends.
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
Even being generous they made maybe 3000 Tigers of all stripe ( << ). The Godless Commies made 84000 T-34s and that 85mm gun was no slouch, the Germans learned to respect it. Have a quick look at that video - an actual tanker explains it better than me. The little guy with the chin whiskers later reveals he's an ex-US tanker.
The Germans overengineered everything and while not a bad thing it didn't hold a candle to powers capable of the production volume of the US and Soviet Union. One interesting (an not unknown or new) point was that as designed tanks were not meant to fight other tanks, that's what tank destroyers and anti-tank guns were for. Didn't work out that way in practice but the theory was sound enough and actually did work out very well when those conditions were met, like in the Pacific.
The Germans overengineered everything and while not a bad thing it didn't hold a candle to powers capable of the production volume of the US and Soviet Union. One interesting (an not unknown or new) point was that as designed tanks were not meant to fight other tanks, that's what tank destroyers and anti-tank guns were for. Didn't work out that way in practice but the theory was sound enough and actually did work out very well when those conditions were met, like in the Pacific.
nivek
As Above So Below
The night I helped sink Hitler's monster battleship: In mountainous Arctic seas, a young officer spotted the vessel trying to escape a Royal Navy trap. What followed was a clash of giants that will never be seen again. Incredibly, he's still alive at 101
Perched at his freezing post above the bridge of the destroyer HMS Scorpion, 21-year-old sub-lieutenant Tony Ditcham stared through his binoculars into the midwinter Arctic darkness, searching for the German battlecruiser.Suddenly star-shells burst overhead 'and where there'd been nothing but black there was this enormous ship, brilliantly illuminated'. Ditcham radioed 'Enemy in sight!' to the gun team below.
Thus, 80 years ago, began the final phase of the last great battle of the Royal Navy's war, a clash of giants that will never be seen again.
Ditcham is one of the very few survivors of the Battle Of The North Cape, fought in the terrible cold and mountainous seas of the Arctic winter on December 26, 1943.
At the age of 101, he is still full of energy, eyes twinkling as he sits in the oak-beamed lounge of a friend's house overlooking the rolling Shropshire countryside recalling in detail the now all-but-forgotten showdown between the leviathan Scharnhorst and the British fleet led by Admiral Sir Bruce Fraser in his flagship Duke of York.
Tony was a pre-war naval cadet and had already been decorated for his heroism serving in destroyers when he learned that he and his Scorpion shipmates were about to be launched on the hunt to sink Hitler's last big serviceable warship. On December 22, as they sat in harbour in Iceland, his captain, Lieutenant Commander Bill Clouston, returned from a conference on board Duke of York to tell them that Fraser had set a trap for Scharnhorst which, if all went well, would send her to the icy bottom of the Barents Sea.
Tony and the rest of the crew were exhausted after long Arctic convoy duty 'ploughing across filthy seas in filthy weather and arriving at the other end to a bleak welcome' from the Soviets, who never showed the slightest gratitude for the Allied war supplies or the risks taken in delivering them.
They were facing a bleak Christmas in Iceland with no prospect of seeing their loved ones. However, the captain's news lifted their spirits.
'We welcomed the chance of firing the guns,' said Tony. 'We wanted the war won and the Scharnhorst sunk.'
The trap was already being set. Having suspended convoys during the summer months when the long days made the merchantmen an easy target, they had now resumed and one had got through safely to Murmansk. Another — codenamed JW 55B — set off from Scotland on December 20 and would cross with the homebound convoy. 'So there would be two juicy convoys at sea' explained Tony. 'And Fraser reckoned that the Germans would find them irresistible.'
The returning convoy, RA 55A, was protected by Force 1, commanded by Vice Admiral Bob Burnett, consisting of the cruisers Belfast, Norfolk and Sheffield and a destroyer escort.
The outbound JW 55B would be followed by Force 2, comprising Duke of York, the cruiser Jamaica and a host of destroyers — but at a distance so as not to scare off Scharnhorst, then lying in Altafjord in Northern Norway.
Hitler's big, expensive battleships had so far proved a disappointment, soaking up huge resources for little military return. Bismarck, the pride of the Kriegsmarine, had been sunk in an epic battle with the Royal Navy in May 1941. Her sister ship Tirpitz was lying crippled in another Norwegian fjord following a daring attack by British midget submarines.
Only Scharnhorst remained at large in Northern waters, but even on her own she posed a mighty threat to the convoys, tying up large numbers of ships that could be put to much better use elsewhere. Scharnhorst had to go. But would the Kriegsmarine commander Admiral Karl Donitz oblige by seizing the chance to prove the ship's worth and in the process deliver a Christmas present to the Fuhrer?
The early signs were encouraging. Luftwaffe reconnaissance patrols picked up the outbound convoy and began shadowing. Then the Bletchley Park codebreakers passed on a secret signal from Germany's naval HQ early on Boxing Day warning German shipping in the area that a flotilla led by Scharnhorst was at sea.
By then Fraser and Force 2 were well on their way. Tony said that when the news was passed to the ships he felt 'a mixture of excitement, apprehension and professional pride in being involved in such a significant historical moment . . . our morale was high and our leaders were battle-hardened.'
The task would be far from easy. Even with radar it would take skill and luck to locate their quarry in the Arctic darkness, relieved only briefly by midday twilight.
Much would depend on Fraser's ability to read the mind of his opposite number, Admiral Erich Bey, a veteran seadog who commanded the enemy flotilla. Even though the Germans were outnumbered, the Scharnhorst was a match for any of the British ships. Her nine 11in guns could overpower the armament of the cruisers and she had a top speed of 31 knots, three knots faster than Duke of York.
'She was a formidable foe,' said Tony. 'She could get away if we tried to catch her and demolish anything of lighter weight.'
As they butted through the iron-grey seas to cut the enemy off before she closed on the incoming convoy, the weather grew steadily more atrocious. That Boxing Day morning Tony took the forenoon watch and recalled that keeping up with Duke of York 'was not easy. We only saw each other if each was at the top of a wave at the same time and mostly we kept station by radar echoes off the foremast.'
The wind and waves tore close-range guns off the front deck of the Duke and tossed them overboard, leaving gaping holes through which seawater cascaded into the hull.
All the ships were 'closed up', with only the officer of the watch, lookouts and signalmen allowed above decks. Down below the air stank of sweat and vomit. A seaman on board Scorpion who risked stepping outside for a breath of fresh air was swept away never to be seen again.
At 9am a blip lit up the search radar of the Force 1 cruiser HMS Belfast protecting RA 55A.
It was Scharnhorst, hunting for the convoy. Bey had sent his five accompanying destroyers off to track down the merchantmen, so the ship was unescorted.
The Force 1 cruisers turned on the Scharnhorst and opened fire at a range of 13,000 yards [7.3 miles] with their six and eight-inch guns. In the duel that followed, Bey's ship was struck twice. One shell destroyed the forward radar controls. From now on, Bey would be fighting half blind and his gunners would have only the muzzle flashes of their enemies on which to fix their aim.
He had little choice but to break off the fight, but was still determined to have a crack at the convoy which was now undefended. He circled round to the north-east to try and get at it, but Burnett second-guessed him. Force 1 moved to intercept and there was another exchange of fire in which the Scharnhorst's gunners managed to hit Norfolk.
But the odds were against Bey and he once again disengaged and headed south, back towards Norway, using his ship's superior speed to try and shake off the pursuers. Two of the British cruisers were forced to slow down with engine trouble but at considerable risk to herself, Burnett's flagship Belfast stayed in radar range and was able to report the enemy position to Fraser and his force, who raced to cut the enemy off.
Just after 4pm, Duke of York's radar indicated that Scharnhorst was only 45,500 yards (26 miles) away and 50 minutes later Fraser was close enough to open fire. Star shells burst above the battleship flooding the darkness with flat, eerie light.
Sitting above the bridge in the steel control tower from where he directed the Scorpion's guns, Tony Ditcham had a grandstand view. 'My first reaction was to think 'what a beautiful ship',' he remembered. The enemy had clearly been taken by surprise because the gun turrets were all facing fore and aft and away from their attackers.
Then there was 'a thunderous crash from astern as Duke of York fired a 14in broadside'. He 'watched the ten great shells climb up into the air going away from us'.
He was able to track them because the 'driving bands' that imparted spin glowed in the dark 'and made them look like tracer bullets'.
Then 'suddenly they plunged down towards their target and a huge wall of water rose up, completely concealing Scharnhorst'.
The first salvo scored a hit, disabling one of the two big front gun turrets, which was 'not bad shooting at six miles, in pitch dark and the ship never steady'.
Bey turned north in a bid to escape but, with Norfolk and Belfast blocking the way, was forced to swing eastwards at maximum knots with the British ships in hot pursuit. Scorpion was with the other destroyers leading the chase.
For an hour and half Tony watched 'the amazing sight of two great battleships firing at each other in pitch dark, the German ship turning night into day with the brilliant flashes from her broadsides'.
Even with the damage to her turret and radar her shells frequently straddled the Duke and one hit the mast but failed to explode.
By early evening it seemed that Fraser's trap had failed and his quarry might escape to fight another day. But then at around 6.30pm, Scharnhorst's hectic pace slackened. One of the Duke's shells, fired at maximum range, hit a boiler room, and despite frantic repair efforts the battleship was now vulnerable to the torpedoes of the destroyers closing on her.
Scorpion's captain ordered full speed ahead while the crew prepared to fire her eight one-ton torpedoes broadside at the giant target. Close behind, the Norwegian navy destroyer Stord did the same.
The dazzling starshells made it difficult to see the ship but it also meant the Germans were unable to see the attackers. But when Scorpion was only 3,500 yards (two miles) away she was spotted.
The Scharnhorst's skipper knew what was coming next and veered sharply away from the expected path of the torpedoes and towards the destroyer, presenting a prime target for Scorpion's four 4.7-inch guns.
Tony shouted 'shoot!' as the giant hull of the battleship rushed past and the first broadside boomed out. 'In the next ten seconds we fired two more broadsides, and all three hit,' he remembered. 'And then she was gone, just as I was beginning to enjoy myself.'
Two of their torpedoes also slammed home. The destroyers Savage and Saumarez braved a hail of fire to launch two more from the other side.
Just before the attack, Bey sent a signal back to German naval command: 'We will fight on until the last shell is fired.' He was as good as his word. Thanks to the torpedo damage Scharnhorst was now limping along at ten knots and was soon easy meat for Duke of York, which began a merciless bombardment under the light of the star shells 'hanging like chandeliers' over the dying ship.
The end came at 7.45pm. Scharnhorst sank bow first and slid into the depths with propellers still turning. Scorpion slowed to a halt and began searching for survivors. Tony saw scores of them, rising and falling in the heavy sea, their cries whipped away by the wind.
Many had already succumbed to the cold and others were 'being killed by these big timbers crashing about' — heavy lumps of wood that all ships carried to block holes torn open by shells. 'We tried like mad to get them in and threw lines out to them,' he said. 'We also dropped landing nets into the water, hung out on brackets to keep them clear of the ship.'
Their hands were too frozen and coated in oil to get a grip. The ship was wallowing in the troughs of huge waves churned up by the force eight gale. Risking their lives, Tony and other crewmen scrambled down the nets to haul the numbed and dazed seamen in. They managed to save 30 German lives and another destroyer rescued six more. All the rest of the 1,968 crew drowned or died of exposure, among them Admiral Bey.
The clash was named the Battle of North Cape and with the Home Fleet's victory the menace to the Arctic convoys from big enemy ships was ended.
For Tony Ditcham it was just one adventure in a wartime career that took him on to the Normandy landings and the Far East, and post-war life as an overseas civil servant in Africa and businessman.
Age has barely slowed him and he walks every day in the countryside around the Shropshire farmhouse he shares with his partner Sarah, a living reminder of a certain breed of Englishman whose like we shall not see again.
A Home On The Rolling Main: A Naval Memoir, 1940-1946 by A.G.F. Ditcham, published by Seaforth.
.
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
I heard, from yet another YT video, that most of Tigers were broken down most of the time and that, according to German own records, there was never more than 500 combat ready Tigers in whole Third Reich. Tiger was rushed into production and, being very complex, it was full of little bugs that needed to be ironed out.
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
That article about Tony Ditcham prompted a geekout, a time waster.
I don't game at all but started wondering how Scharnhorst and how it might stack up against some of the contemporaries it never met. Like Japanese light and heavy cruisers it carried torpedo tubes and would have had a slight speed advantage over most, but really would have been punching out if it's weight class.
You couldn't write better fiction that the struggle for the Solomons, especially in 1942. To say 'the issue was in doubt' was putting it mildly. The Imperial Japanese Navy took pains to demonstrate why they were the masters of night warfare and tactics and that their equipment was very, very good. I believe there were seven major engagements and we had our asses handed to us in at least six of them. We simply couldn't cope with the level of training they enjoyed at the time, and their torpedoes certainly worked just fine.
The engagement I am thinking of was one of the last in that struggle and we had about run out of warships for the Japanese to sink. Enter Ching Lee. If we were to meet him I wouldn't expect a larger than life character like Halsey, this guy was a competent professional. And an Olympic sharpshooter. There was a story from I think in Panama, of him sitting calmly cross legged on top of a ship's turret patiently waiting for one of the several snipers that had been taking potshots to reveal themselves. In short order with his '03 Springfield he dealt with them all. The combination of his understanding of ballistics and then cutting edge radar technology made his entrance on to History's stage a really, really good one.
If he could do that well with a Springfield, later give that man a North Carolina-class battleship class battleship. North Carolina was floating at its dock in Wilmington DE when I was there in the '90s. Hot, smelly and for the most part in it's original kit. Impressive. You can still see repaired battle damage. It's only sister ship Washington was what Lee brought to the table one night in 1942 and although the action was a hodgepodge it showed what that platform could do in the right hands. Accompanying him that night was another BB - the South Dakota-class battleship (1939) USS South Dakota. Apart from being a flaming target it didn't exactly distinguish itself, but it certainly managed to shrug off what most couldn't. So much so that I began to wonder how something like Scarnhorst would've fared - not well I suspect against a bruiser like IJN Kirishima. It was one of two BBs they lost in this struggle. There wasn't another heavyweight matchup like this until much later at Suriago Straight in the Phillippines.
For whatever reason, the Nazis didn't use a prefix for their warships.
Robert Ballard, the many who has found so many relics located and dove on IJN Kirishima. The actual hit rate of the 16" shells from Washington was low, something like 9 projectiles out of dozens thrown, but they were big. He also found that Washington's secondary 5" armament riddled it's opponent, apparently they were better shots. The Japanese scuttled it but it was already an inoperable wreck. I believe it's resting upside down and to put i in technical terms, has been blown all to ****.
This is a very long article that explains the action. Good story if you want to take the time. Imagine what those young men in the PT boats must've thought.......
https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval-history-magazine/2011/january/washington-wins-draw
USS Washington
USS South Dakota
IJN Kirishima
Scharnhorst
I don't game at all but started wondering how Scharnhorst and how it might stack up against some of the contemporaries it never met. Like Japanese light and heavy cruisers it carried torpedo tubes and would have had a slight speed advantage over most, but really would have been punching out if it's weight class.
You couldn't write better fiction that the struggle for the Solomons, especially in 1942. To say 'the issue was in doubt' was putting it mildly. The Imperial Japanese Navy took pains to demonstrate why they were the masters of night warfare and tactics and that their equipment was very, very good. I believe there were seven major engagements and we had our asses handed to us in at least six of them. We simply couldn't cope with the level of training they enjoyed at the time, and their torpedoes certainly worked just fine.
The engagement I am thinking of was one of the last in that struggle and we had about run out of warships for the Japanese to sink. Enter Ching Lee. If we were to meet him I wouldn't expect a larger than life character like Halsey, this guy was a competent professional. And an Olympic sharpshooter. There was a story from I think in Panama, of him sitting calmly cross legged on top of a ship's turret patiently waiting for one of the several snipers that had been taking potshots to reveal themselves. In short order with his '03 Springfield he dealt with them all. The combination of his understanding of ballistics and then cutting edge radar technology made his entrance on to History's stage a really, really good one.
If he could do that well with a Springfield, later give that man a North Carolina-class battleship class battleship. North Carolina was floating at its dock in Wilmington DE when I was there in the '90s. Hot, smelly and for the most part in it's original kit. Impressive. You can still see repaired battle damage. It's only sister ship Washington was what Lee brought to the table one night in 1942 and although the action was a hodgepodge it showed what that platform could do in the right hands. Accompanying him that night was another BB - the South Dakota-class battleship (1939) USS South Dakota. Apart from being a flaming target it didn't exactly distinguish itself, but it certainly managed to shrug off what most couldn't. So much so that I began to wonder how something like Scarnhorst would've fared - not well I suspect against a bruiser like IJN Kirishima. It was one of two BBs they lost in this struggle. There wasn't another heavyweight matchup like this until much later at Suriago Straight in the Phillippines.
For whatever reason, the Nazis didn't use a prefix for their warships.
Robert Ballard, the many who has found so many relics located and dove on IJN Kirishima. The actual hit rate of the 16" shells from Washington was low, something like 9 projectiles out of dozens thrown, but they were big. He also found that Washington's secondary 5" armament riddled it's opponent, apparently they were better shots. The Japanese scuttled it but it was already an inoperable wreck. I believe it's resting upside down and to put i in technical terms, has been blown all to ****.
This is a very long article that explains the action. Good story if you want to take the time. Imagine what those young men in the PT boats must've thought.......
https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval-history-magazine/2011/january/washington-wins-draw
USS Washington
USS South Dakota
IJN Kirishima
Scharnhorst
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
It had to have been a 17 pounder - also a 76.2mm and more likely to be in a western European parts depot. God, an old comic really got in my head ...................
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
Most lethal sniper in Marine Corps history, Chuck Mawhinney, dead at 75
The US Marine Corps’ deadliest sniper, Charles “Chuck” Mawhinney, who went nearly two decades avoiding any recognition for his kill record until it was revealed in a bpok, has died. Mawhinney died at his home in Baker City, Oregon, on Feb. 12, the Baker City Herald reported. He was 75.
Born in Lakeview, Oregon, Mawhinney began his legendary career in 1967 after he graduated from high school and enlisted in the Marine Corps that year to fight in Vietnam.
Upon joining the service, he attended Scout Sniper School at Camp Pendleton and, following his graduation in April 1968, received orders to South Vietnam on a 16-month rotation, according to the US Marine Corps.
6Charles “Chuck” Mawhinney is credited with the most sniper kills in the history of the Marine Corps.Courtesy of Chuck Mawhinney
6Mawhinney poses with a replica of the M40 sniper rifle he used during the Vietnam War.Pfc. Garrett White
From 1968 to 1969, Mawhinney — still only a teenager — was credited with 103 confirmed kills.
An additional 216 kills were listed as “probable” since the enemies’ bodies were risky to verify in the active war zone.
Mawhinney had confirmed kills over 1,000 yards, with the average kill shot for snipers during the Vietnam War taken at a distance of 300 to 800 yards.
He received a Bronze Star with Combat Valor, Navy Achievement Medal, Navy Commendation Medal with Combat Valor, and two Purple Hearts.
6Mawhinney was only a teenager when he was credited with 103 confirmed kills.Courtesy of Chuck Mawhinney
Despite having the highest kill count of any sniper in the branch’s history, Mawhinney returned home in 1970, slipped back into everyday life without recognition, and secured a job with the US Forest Service.
For years, it was believed that fellow Marine Corps legend Carlos Hathcock held the highest kill count as a sniper with 93: He still has one of the longest kills ever recorded at 2,500 yards.
It wouldn’t be until 1991 when one of Mawhinney’s spotters in Vietnam, Joseph T. Ward, wrote the book “Dear Mom: A Sniper’s Vietnam” and credited him with holding the record, citing his 101 kills.
At first, many weren’t aware of the book — Mawhinney included.
6Mawhinney was in Vietnam with one of his spotters, who assisted him in identifying targets during the war.Courtesy of Chuck Mawhinney
6An additional 216 kills were listed as “probable” since the enemies’ bodies were risky to verify in the active war zone.Courtesy of Chuck Mawhinney
However, word slowly began to spread in the years to follow that Mawhinney was being credited with the most confirmed sniper kills in Marine Corps history.
It caused controversy among members of the sniper community, who still believed Hathcock held the record.
Peter Senich, a military historian and author specializing in sniping and small arms, went to verify Ward’s claim in the Marine Corps archives and found he was wrong. Mawhinney didn’t have 101 kills — he had 103.
Mawhinney, a man who valued his privacy and was not seeking any fame for his actions in Vietnam, agreed to an interview with Senich in 1997, which was featured in the Baker City Herald.
6Mawhinney (center) with fellow snipers and spotters in front of the sniper tent at An Hoi, Vietnam.Courtesy of Chuck Mawhinney
“It’s an opportunity for me to get some recognition for a lot of the Vietnam vets that didn’t receive any recognition,” Mawhinney said.
“We were all there together. If I have to take recognition for it, that’s OK, because every time I talk to someone, I can talk about the vets. It gives me an opportunity to talk about what a great job they did.”
Following his interview and newfound fame among the military community, Mawhinney retired from the US Forest Service in 1997 and began attending events across the country with his wife, Robin.
The legendary sniper told his life story to author Jim Lindsay, who wrote the book “The Sniper: The Untold Story of the Marine Corps’ Greatest Marksman of All Time” in March 2023.
“He was a good man,” said Lindsay in an interview with The Oregonian Wednesday, sharing that Mawhinney never boasted about his kills and said he “did what I was trained to do.”
“He was a good father, a good husband and an asset to the community. He was a pretty cool cat.”
Mawhinney leaves behind a wife and three children.
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