This New Kind of Battery Can Be Fully Charged in Less Than 30 Seconds

Discussion in 'Alternative Technologies & Energetics' started by CasualBystander, Mar 1, 2018.

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  1. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    This New Kind of Battery Can Be Fully Charged in Less Than 30 Seconds

    The anode is polymer chains and the cathode is a sheet of graphene,
    [​IMG]
    A novel approach to an energy storage device run on an aqueous electrolyte can go from flat to fully-charged in just 20 seconds, making it perfect for portable electronics that frequently need a quick boost.

    The battery uses liquid water-based electrolyte and a graphene electrode.

    Just think: laptop/smartphone batteries that don't explode...

    Hasn't been commercialized yet but they claim they have worked the bugs out.

    I'm a little skeptical because to fast charge a battery it has to have almost zero internal resistance.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2018
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  2. Kchoo

    Kchoo At Peace.

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    Well, they can do this, and combine it with solar panel technology, it has potential.

    (Get it?)

    Potential!

    I am happy to see this discovery, and I hope it proves viable. The article says it works... now we just need to find out how well it works.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2018
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  3. ChrisIB

    ChrisIB Honorable

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    Remember reading an intro to battery technology which began with the statement
    'A battery is essentially a slowly exploding bomb'! so perhaps having all that energy in a small space will pose some new problems!
    (I believe the lower internal resistance the better, say not good to short a car battery)
     
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  4. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    Yup.

    Don't want to short circuit a low impedance power source.
     
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  5. 3FEL9

    3FEL9 Islander

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    I was thinking of this when I read your reply..

    In a power generation scenario you'd want to transfer at the max rated capacity of your generator. I.E power source

    Do generators impedance match those of their consumers ?

    Maximum power transfer theorem - Wikipedia
     
  6. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    Well, this is true.

    But you aren't obtaining power you are absorbing charge.

    Let's look at a 50 ohm source feeding a 50 ohm load with 1 amp of current.

    Half the power is dissipated in source (your power brick gets hot).

    50 Watts in the source, 50 watts in the load. A larger load impedance reduces current and power transfer. A lower impedance increases current but reduces the power dissipated in the load (most of the power is now dissipated in the source).

    For a battery charger you want a low impedance source and low impedance battery because all that resistance generates heat which is a waste of energy.

    The purpose of a battery is to hold charge, not to get hot and explode like Li-ion batteries do occasionally.
     
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  7. spacecase0

    spacecase0 earth human

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    I wonder if the voltage out curve is any different than the super capacitors currently for sale
     
  8. 3FEL9

    3FEL9 Islander

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    Yup, And then add complex reactance and things get more interesting.. Power companies are starting to charge for VA to ordinary homes soon..
     
  9. 3FEL9

    3FEL9 Islander

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    I'm thinking pulling up in a Tesla to a 'gas' station and refueling in 20 seconds..

    Their batteries are already liquid cooled. me believes. so the generated waste heat could be disposed of safely
     
  10. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    Let's take a 100 KWH battery. Let's use the nominal Tesla voltage of 375 V.

    Let's say charging is 95% efficient.

    Let's refuel it in 20 seconds.

    100 * 1000 * 3600 = 3.6*10**8 joules.

    3.6*10**8 * 0.05 = 1.8*10**7 joules. Total charge: (at 95% efficiency) 1.01 * 10 ** 6 Coulumb.


    Boiling point of water is 212. 4000 j/kg-K. Assume 33 C (91.4 F). 67 degrees to go.

    Assume 200 Kg power pack.

    In theory the temperature of the power pack would be raised 22.5 K if it were made of water.

    Average current for 20 seconds would be

    Just looking at these I'd be worried. Steel (for example) has 1/10 the specific heat of water and the temperature would hit about 250 C.

    The other problem is the 50,526 A. If you drop the time to one hour the current is 280 Amps which is in line with the 340 A quoted for fast superchargers.

    Charging at 50,526 A is the same as continuously striking the car with lightning for 20 seconds.

    Looks like the Tesla battery pack is about 550 kg.

    Believe the charging will warm the battery more than indicated. Will recheck the math to see why the number is so low.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2018
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  11. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    "Sigh"

    Average current for 20 seconds would be 50,526 A

    20 second power dissipation of 1.8*10**7 joules for a 550 kg power pack is 32727 joules per kilogram.

    Given that the primary power dissipation is in a small area around the electrodes I'm smelling explosion here.
     
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  12. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    Probably should add: the 20 second charge rate power dissipation is like warming up 550 women's hair dryers (a 1750 W type - about 100 watts drives the fan, that leaves 1650 W for the heating coils) and then focusing them on the battery pack for 20 seconds.
     
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  13. 3FEL9

    3FEL9 Islander

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    Well, I dont think I'll be stayin much longer than 10 minutes at any given refueling station.. thsts 600 seconds.
     
  14. spacecase0

    spacecase0 earth human

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    my guess is that any electric car that needs fast charging will end up with removable battery packs.
    if you had a setup at home, your solar could charge the battery all day long, then it would automatically be switched when you park your car.
    long distance travel could be done the same way, you just rent the battery and pay to have a full one swapped in. (like people do propane tank exchanges now)
     
  15. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    The idea sounds good.

    But making a 1200 pound pack swappable is sort of dangerous and would add a couple of hundred pounds to the car's weight.

    What if you drop the pack when swapping?
     
  16. spacecase0

    spacecase0 earth human

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    I would use an automated system to change it, something like a tiny automatic forklift
    other thought is to have it on wheels on little tracks, you have a cart with the same rails that connects off the the car, so you are never really lifting it and there is little chance of dropping it unless you are trying to mess up. you can make the wheels on the edges in a way so that if you try to get it out of the car or the cart it will stop moving once the wheel has left the track.
    if done correctly I don't think it would add to much weight.
    finding good power connectors would likely be the hardest part of the design
     
  17. AlterEgo

    AlterEgo Honorable

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    A Tesla version of this

    [​IMG]
     
  18. 3FEL9

    3FEL9 Islander

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  19. CasualBystander

    CasualBystander Celestial

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    Sounds good - but we will see when it hits the streets.

    They must have significantly cut battery resistance.

    This would also require lower resistance charging packs.
     
  20. 3FEL9

    3FEL9 Islander

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    I need one now, my 2015 samsung battery depletes itself in 30 minutes 'smartphoning' off the charger. Its very well cycled lol

    Btw, Koreans are clever,, they produce both fossil fuel seeking - deep sea drill ships and green batteries..
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2018

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