Is God Scientifically Possible?
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Shadowprophet
Truthiness
I don't remember where I got this ideology from, But, The two topics are so very different in Nature.
One Side, You have Science, A formulaic study, based on Hypothesis, Theory, and Fact. On the other, You have the idea of a Grand Designer and all we have in regards to any kind of data are old stories from ancient texts. To believe in a deity Requires Faith. Faith is something that can not be quantified or measured. Faith is so far removed from science, One could consider Fact and Faith to be complete polar opposites. In this regard, Science and Religion will always have conflict, Because, by their very design, The two concepts are so vastly different from one another.
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
Science is not limited.
Science includes reality check, but science doesn't impose limitations on reality check, so anything can be discovered. There were dozens of big discoveries that defied common sense and previous scientific dogma and all these had to surrender to the reality check. Good example is nature of light, that was proposed by Faraday to be linked electromagnetic field. He was ridiculed behind his back, yet after he died it was proven through a reality check. Same applies to the whole field of quantum mechanics and many other fields.
The only way science is "limited" is that it doesn't include wishful thinking.
nivek
As Above So Below
Perhaps I should have included 'our understanding'...Our understanding of reality is extremely limited...
...
AlienView
Noble
Max Planck was a Noble Prize winner in physics and developer of Quantum Mechanics.
- He did not believe in God in a religious sense and said so.
On the other hand he also said:
“All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together.
We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.”
― Max Planck
{This is what I call 'scientific intelligent design'} - It requires only observation, no faith required.
- He did not believe in God in a religious sense and said so.
On the other hand he also said:
“All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together.
We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.”
― Max Planck
{This is what I call 'scientific intelligent design'} - It requires only observation, no faith required.
Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
I don't agree with Plank. Its just dumb boring force. What does that even has to do with mind.
But I don't think that even aliens, who might be up to 2 billion years ahead of us, know how Universe started. No intelligence will ever find that out because all the data is destroyed each time universe is born.
AlienView
Noble
I 'speculate' that aliens ahead of us may have literally created this universe and may have created many others.
Why? Because all creation is experimental in nature - That is observable.
One need not give a reason for the experiments - that's what science does, it gives theories, hypothetical scenarios, and then conducts experiments to validate.
Alien experimenters may have created many universes - And just because the Human is a failure in this one does not
mean that Humanoids created in other universes may not have turned out better.
Want me to prove it? Not yet. But I'll still follow Planck who also said:
pigfarmer
tall, thin, irritable
Couldn't help but think of some of the things contemporary science got wrong across various eras. Yet, at the time they were accepted. Heliocentric system, heavier than air flight, germ theory etc. If 'science' were the task of some unemotional AI things would be different and a hell of a lot faster. It's not. Like everything else it's subject to human foibles.; ego, intransigence, vested interests etc like every other human endeavor. It needs to be leavened with a dose of humility
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Dejan Corovic
As above, so bellow
Yeah, you can't use common sense when you want and than don't use it when you don't want. Either you use all the time or you don't use it at all and just write beautiful thoughts.
Common sense here is the chicken and the egg one: who created the aliens? Did aliens create universe or universe created aliens?
I think that within the realm of common sense only universe created the aliens.
The rest is just beautiful thinking, or downright manipulation, however you see it.
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Kchoo
At Peace.
So, I am a Christian. When I was a young man, I invited God into my heart through the Bible teachings of Jesus.
And I received a tingly sensation from the top of my head, down through my shoulder, into my armpits and down my spine and into my chest. They call it God's blessing. The armor of God. It feels warm and energizing and secure and safe.
There is no proof this is from God. It could very well be the many other things.
But, there is nothing else like it. So I am glad it happened. It still happens when I share this story. It comes back. It comes back anytime I think about it really...
It feels like something spiritual. It feels divine. What else could this be, but a connection to something bigger than me?
As to what that something is, I can only choose to believe for myself. No one can tell me how to interpret it, for it is also bigger than any opinion, yet it remains virtually undefined.
I want to believe it is a divine blessing. I can't apply anything else to it for my satisfaction, but there is still a part of me that wonders... maybe it is just a cosmic energy connection... or maybe it is just an extreme style of goosebumps without the bumps... Then a big part of me says, Nah... its gotta be something big!
But, scientifically, in my mind, God can't be seen by science.
So, another thing- a disembodied voice has spoken to me audibly a few times.
How do we science that? And yet, how does one hear it, and interpret it as anything less than a religious experience? If we don't understand it's Origin, we base it on feeling, and then, Yeah, we are infinite beings. But if we base it on science, it is just an undefined thing with many guesses, and a few possibilites, but it is still indefinable.
So humans are both, emotional and logical beings. Emotion evokes a sense of spirit.
Logic invokes a sense of rationale, and this is simply a human dichotomy which is always going to be at odds.
God can't be proven scientifically.
But my emotional side feels a connection to God, regardless of my rationale.
Funny thing this dichotomy, but I ain't laughing.
And I received a tingly sensation from the top of my head, down through my shoulder, into my armpits and down my spine and into my chest. They call it God's blessing. The armor of God. It feels warm and energizing and secure and safe.
There is no proof this is from God. It could very well be the many other things.
But, there is nothing else like it. So I am glad it happened. It still happens when I share this story. It comes back. It comes back anytime I think about it really...
It feels like something spiritual. It feels divine. What else could this be, but a connection to something bigger than me?
As to what that something is, I can only choose to believe for myself. No one can tell me how to interpret it, for it is also bigger than any opinion, yet it remains virtually undefined.
I want to believe it is a divine blessing. I can't apply anything else to it for my satisfaction, but there is still a part of me that wonders... maybe it is just a cosmic energy connection... or maybe it is just an extreme style of goosebumps without the bumps... Then a big part of me says, Nah... its gotta be something big!
But, scientifically, in my mind, God can't be seen by science.
So, another thing- a disembodied voice has spoken to me audibly a few times.
How do we science that? And yet, how does one hear it, and interpret it as anything less than a religious experience? If we don't understand it's Origin, we base it on feeling, and then, Yeah, we are infinite beings. But if we base it on science, it is just an undefined thing with many guesses, and a few possibilites, but it is still indefinable.
So humans are both, emotional and logical beings. Emotion evokes a sense of spirit.
Logic invokes a sense of rationale, and this is simply a human dichotomy which is always going to be at odds.
God can't be proven scientifically.
But my emotional side feels a connection to God, regardless of my rationale.
Funny thing this dichotomy, but I ain't laughing.
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
The Funny thing about Speaking about Religion online is, Yes, Even I am a Christian. But there is a bias about Religion online, I could speak Science to its fullest to people online. But If I went full Christian, Became nonapologetic about it, The whole internet would cringe, People would be screaming, But Shadow, How can you claim to love science, Or even know how to pee standing up if you Belive...
And It's real, IT's a Real Disdain,
Even Hollywood Stars lose their Standing because of their belief. But people will say, But Shadow, The Church is against Being Gay. Yeah, That's the Thing about Religions, They are a set of rules about how to live one's life. some things fall outside the guidelines, Thats how guidelines work... What can I say.. walking fifteen miles a day isn't for everyone, But then Not everyone is a hundred fifty pounds overweight... so..... Different strokes for different folks I guess.
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
I guess If there is one thing that does Urk me about Speaking about religion online is, It's knowing that by far most people don't Hate Religion as much as they claim to online. IT's just a hot debate topic that's been done to death and everyone has a few good zingers they can always throw down to look good in conversational debate.
Meanwhile back in their real lives they just got back from church because their *fill in the blank family member just got married, I love reminding people, Especally Atheists,, I will ask, Are you married? some will say yeah, Did you promise before the janitor or the fireman to take her as your lawfully wedded wife?
How does it feel Mr. Athiest, To have Made a promise before God?
It always pisses them off...
Many people who Refuse to admit they Believe in God, Still Practice his institutions, lets see how many Atheists Hate the Idea of God So Much, They run out and get Divorced because they made a promise to God, Even Those who Deny God, Use and practice the belief when it benefits them, So many of those people speaking out against religion Use it to full benefit.
So I'm just curious, Does being married mean those people have low IQs or what? I mean they stood before someone and made a promise to God... And let's be fair, How Dumb would they have had to have been to stand before all those people and make a promise to a God they didn't believe was there?
Meanwhile back in their real lives they just got back from church because their *fill in the blank family member just got married, I love reminding people, Especally Atheists,, I will ask, Are you married? some will say yeah, Did you promise before the janitor or the fireman to take her as your lawfully wedded wife?
How does it feel Mr. Athiest, To have Made a promise before God?
It always pisses them off...
Many people who Refuse to admit they Believe in God, Still Practice his institutions, lets see how many Atheists Hate the Idea of God So Much, They run out and get Divorced because they made a promise to God, Even Those who Deny God, Use and practice the belief when it benefits them, So many of those people speaking out against religion Use it to full benefit.
So I'm just curious, Does being married mean those people have low IQs or what? I mean they stood before someone and made a promise to God... And let's be fair, How Dumb would they have had to have been to stand before all those people and make a promise to a God they didn't believe was there?
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
I don't know, Sometimes, I like to stoke the fires a Bit, But, In such a lopsided issue as Religion, an almost universally despised topic. someone needs to work the other side to keep it fresh...
Rick Hunter
Celestial
I don't really care if God is scientifically provable or not. And, I am especially tired of people who try to use science to prove or disprove religion. Science and religion are two different fields of study and epistemology. They have some overlap, but it makes no sense to me to use one to completely prove or disprove the other. Now, one could come up with a concept of a God-like entity or force in science. As in, a universal source of energy and matter that follows predictable patterns has certain unchanging characteristics. But that is not the same God that most religions talk about.
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
It took me days to get back to you on this, I very much miss the days I could just do nothing and enjoy it. Long gone are those peaceful restful days..
I think by far most people who have an issue with God, Are those people who have a notion that the God I'm talking about, Or the God the Catholic church is talking about, Or even the God, Touchy bob the priest speaks about is literal God. The problem with that is, None of us are qualified or have the capacity to behold or even comprehend a deity. We can't even lay down clear guidelines as to what constitutes a God.
Someone told them, Don't do that, It's a sin, Or you're going to hell because of X reason, And that right there is wrong, No one is anyone else's judge, The God they think they know, Is a biased picture that someone else unqualified to do so painted and forced upon them.
I see both sides. The God that I know, OR have come to understand, Only wants for me to do one thing. Treat other people with as much kindness and love as I am able to produce, The whole judgment of others and telling them they are going to hell for x reason,, That's not what I was told to do, I was told to never judge other people, That it's not my place.
People know the God they were told about, Usually from someone else who had their own ideas about what God was, So there was bias even then... My wish would be that people get to know the God they Judge, Not through some third party.
But directly by seeking him.. They would get to know a different deity than the one they have been told about...
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
I'll grant you that, Religion as it's defined,
And this is from Google, provided, Some people prefer Websters because a whole lot of words have different definitions with webster. But,, Religion Defined amounts to, the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
That's the definition, Loosely, Belief, Does not require Worship, But once worship begins it is religion. I feel like Religion needs a better definition, something about that definition just falls short.
Because, The worship of a deity, isn't exactly what you mean here. You mean, The pointless rituals and pomp and circumstance that is repeated weekly. The things that aren't really a religion at all by definition, Those things are more like Club activities that I can promise you, Change not from belief to belief, But from group to group. think of the most boring "religious" ceremony you can imagine. Whatever group you chose, Be it, Christian, Catholic, And yes the two are not synonymous, They are extremely different beliefs. or Buddhist, or Jewish, Those people you thought about, Had other churches that claimed to be the same thing but worshiped differently, for instance, Churches in china, and there are Christian churches there, Those are a little different than say, The church down the street.
I could get into Spirit Here, A subject that I know you grasp well, So, It's my understanding, That Humans Tend to share their selves with others, you could even say we share our spirit with others via way of emotional connection, It's something we all do, Even with strangers, We convey emotions like anger or fear, or indifference,
Emotions, As you well know, Having the hobby you do, Emotions tend to spread, or even in negative examples contaminate other people, So, If you have a church or a group of people, with enough negative influence, It will affect other people there. It's just a psychological fact.
From the outside, People look to Church and religion, And they expect perfection, So they ask, Why is there so much corruption there. Hospitals don't have perfection, They are full of sick people,
What would a room full of spiritually sick people look like? In a church, you could in theory find very sick very hurt people, Just looking for a way out, It's a place, Or the idea of it, Is a place for spiritually sick people to heal. So why wouldn't there be corruption there, More so than in a lot of places?
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
True, But, if the salad has meat on it, It's not Vegan, And if the salad has cheese on it, It's not lactose-free.
Descriptors exist so we don't mistake A vegan for a meat-eater.
This
Because Believe me, That woman at the table Would absolutely love it if people mistook her for a Thin Vegan.
for this....
Or
Just like This Guy.
Would Love it, IF you mistook him for this,
But, The Fact is, No matter how much paint you put Santa in up there, It's not Kathy Ireland.
Heck, I would love to check my bank account and instead of thousands there be Millions, But
No matter how much I want My salad to taste like a quarter pounder you still chose salad for me.. and it shall never be a Burger because of those choices.
And even though, That Burger has many of the same ingredients in it, Like a little meat, Some Cheese, Some veggies, It's really not a salad at all, is it?
Shadowprophet
Truthiness
Notice the themes in those pics,, The paths people in those pics chose Some worked hard to achieve what they had, Others made other choices but still want to be recognized as the same thing.
Would you enjoy it if some young teen, Came through slapped his phone on the table with two sentences typed out on it, and suddenly had better standing at your workplace than you and all those years you put into it? That's what society would like, an environment where people couldn't tell or recognize the hard work you put in, and young David who had just signed on last week would love it too. Because he didn't have to even put in effort for his spot... By your logic though, Young David should be just as deserving, Correct? No matter how much we don't like the idea, Everyone is not the same, People do make choices and those choices change the paths they take in life... Young David is not an experienced worker that deserves your spot at work, it doesn't matter even if he types three whole sentences complete with emojis, he still wouldn't...
With all that said, Thanks for getting me a Salad, You made the right choice,
Would you enjoy it if some young teen, Came through slapped his phone on the table with two sentences typed out on it, and suddenly had better standing at your workplace than you and all those years you put into it? That's what society would like, an environment where people couldn't tell or recognize the hard work you put in, and young David who had just signed on last week would love it too. Because he didn't have to even put in effort for his spot... By your logic though, Young David should be just as deserving, Correct? No matter how much we don't like the idea, Everyone is not the same, People do make choices and those choices change the paths they take in life... Young David is not an experienced worker that deserves your spot at work, it doesn't matter even if he types three whole sentences complete with emojis, he still wouldn't...
With all that said, Thanks for getting me a Salad, You made the right choice,
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